| Whats your opinion? |
| Bring in ID Cards |
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44% |
[ 4 ] |
| Don't Bring in ID Cards |
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55% |
[ 5 ] |
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| Total Votes : 9 |
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CJ Cregg
Commodore
Joined: 05 Oct 2002
Posts: 1254
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 Wed May 25, 2005 5:21 pm Identity Card plan |
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| Quote: | Blair defends identity card plan
ID cards are needed to stop the soaring costs of identity theft, Prime Minister Tony Blair has said as proposals for a national scheme were reintroduced.
The plan is for cards to be phased in from 2008, and made compulsory later.
The Conservatives have now decided they will join the Lib Dems and some Labour in opposing the measure.
Critics claim Mr Blair is highlighting ID theft as his other reasons for the cards have not won support. The cost of the scheme has risen since November.
Passport costs
The Home Office will not put a figure on the cost of setting up the cards system, saying it is commercially sensitive.
But the scheme will cost an estimated �584m to run every year - a cost of �93 per card, compared with an estimated cost of �85 per card in November.
Ministers stress they have not yet decided what fees people would have to pay for the cards.
| Quote: | ID CARDS BILL INCLUDES:
Covers whole UK
Establishes national ID register
Powers to issue ID cards
Ensures checks can be made against other databases to cross check people's ID
Lists safeguards on the sort of data that can be held
New criminal offence of possessing false ID documents
Provides a power to make it compulsory in the future to register and be issued with an ID cards |
Discounts would be available to some card holders but Home Office Minister Tony McNulty refused to speculate whether other people would have to pay more than �93.
He said the latest cost estimate was more "robust" than the figure given last November.
And he argued that 70% of the cost would be spent on new biometric passports whether or not ID cards were introduced.
The latest Identity Cards Bill was published on Wednesday but it contains only "minor amendments" to the plans which were dropped when the election was called.
Changes include giving more responsibilities to the watchdog charged with overseeing the scheme and new checks on which government agencies can access ID card information.
Mr McNulty said: "A secure compulsory national identity cards scheme will help tackle illegal immigration, organised crime, ID fraud, terrorism and will benefit all UK citizens."
The results of a trial involving 10,000 volunteers were also published.
It said most people enrolled successfully on all the different types of biometric scheme.
But iris scan technology was less successful with black people and people aged over 59, said the report.
Mr McNulty denied the scheme was discriminatory and stressed the trials were not designed to test the technology.
"Those who know far more than I suggest that the technology is moving in the right direction," he said.
'Unproved' technology
The Conservatives and Lib Dems predict they could defeat the plans in Parliament.
The Tories initially voted for the ID card legislation in the last Parliament but abstained in the key Commons vote.
They will now vote against the scheme, saying it has not passed their five tests.
Shadow home secretary David Davis said: "The truth is the government has not taken our concerns seriously and as a result we have to oppose it."
Mr Davis said the scheme was very expensive and ineffective, using "completely unproved" technology.
'Machismo'
He also had civil liberties concerns about the scheme.
The Lib Dems say they are opposed to the plans in principle and spokesman Mark Oaten seized on the latest cost figures.
"We have always argued this is a project that is going to run out of control financially," he said.
Labour backbencher Neil Gerrard said opinion polls suggested public support for ID cards would change once people knew the costs and if the scheme became compulsory.
Shami Chakrabarti, from civil rights group Liberty, urged MPs to reject what she said was a "rehashed bill that is more about political machismo than rational policy".
Story from BBC NEWS |
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed May 25, 2005 5:23 pm |
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I think it's actually a good idea.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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CJ Cregg
Commodore
Joined: 05 Oct 2002
Posts: 1254
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| Wed May 25, 2005 5:25 pm |
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It's a stupid and expensive idea that won't achive anything!
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed May 25, 2005 5:29 pm |
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| charmed88 wrote: | | It's a stupid and expensive idea that won't achive anything! |
Yes, it will achieve something: better security.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Hitchhiker
Rear Admiral
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 3514
Location: Ontario, Canada
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| Wed May 25, 2005 5:40 pm |
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I agree with ID cards provided they are implemented the correct way. I wouldn't want them to be too restrictive, but we already have a lot of ID cards in a way: drivers' license, voting registration, social insurance number, library card. If one single ID card were instituted, then I can see it having a positive effect.
I don't like the costs involved, however, so the concept should be rethought and refined, but not totally abandoned.
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zero
Rear Admiral
Joined: 03 Apr 2005
Posts: 4566
Location: Texas
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| Wed May 25, 2005 5:41 pm |
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I think it is better than having your identity stolen.
I know 4 people that have had it happen to them. I shred everything!!!!!!
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Thu May 26, 2005 10:48 am |
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I think it's really bad as well. Look at Spain, they didn't stop the Madrid bombings. It'll just clamp down on people's freedom even more.
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madlilnerd
Duchess of Dancemat
Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 5885
Location: Slough, England
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| Thu May 26, 2005 10:53 am |
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Don't agree with them. "Big Brother" watches me too much as it is. Give ATM machines retina or fingerprint scanners to stop identity theft. If you don't want your identity stolen, shred all your documents.
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Thu May 26, 2005 10:59 am |
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Also, RM, you support ID cards, yet when people say guns should be banned the government getting too much control. ID cards have the option of FAR more government control than any ban on guns do.
Not meaning this to sound like an attack, just why do you think that way.
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Seven of Nine
Sammie's Mammy
Joined: 16 Jun 2001
Posts: 7871
Location: North East England
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| Thu May 26, 2005 2:18 pm |
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I'm against them. First of all, the biometric scanning fails in 2-30+% of the test cases- depending on the method. Therefore there would need to be some kind of backup.
Secondly, the way the government wants to introduce them would mean that too much of our everyday lives would be monitored, and they haven't said how they'd stop too much information sharing, such as the police, schools and social services getting hold of your medical records without your knowledge or constent. I don't want the government to have that much control.
Thirdly, it just won't work to prevent terrorism (the original reason they were proposed- dropped after the Madrid bombings.
So far, all forms of ID in this country are voluntary (since your birth certificates and NI cards are not proof of identity according to the items in question  ). OK, you can't get very far without something, but I don't need to get a passport/driving licence/ID card unless I want to. Not only will this be compulsary, but the government is proposing that a person spends their own money on them! If they want to bring them in, they shouldn't charge nearly �100 for them (which is more than double what the law currently says a single person needs to live of in a week, for comparison).
I think this is a bad idea, and I hope it doesn't happen.
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madlilnerd
Duchess of Dancemat
Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 5885
Location: Slough, England
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| Thu May 26, 2005 2:24 pm |
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What would happen if I forgot my ID card one day? Would Police take me out of the country?
ID cards are as threatening as tattooing barcodes on people at birth.
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Thu May 26, 2005 4:25 pm |
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I don't like it. Let it be up to the states to mandate and manage ID's if they want.
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Seven of Nine
Sammie's Mammy
Joined: 16 Jun 2001
Posts: 7871
Location: North East England
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| Thu May 26, 2005 4:29 pm |
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We're talking about Britain
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