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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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 Tue May 17, 2005 6:17 pm |
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| madlilnerd wrote: | | Om wrote: | | well, it speaks of a 'militia'. what about cops? what if only they had guns? i don't like guns at all of course, because they are made for killing. plus, the circumstances under which this ammendment was written was colonial america. times are different and guns are more advanced. violent crime would drop drastically if cops were the only ones allowed to have guns. |
Yeah, it's a really old law, and perhaps a little outdated. I mean, it's not like a bear or a native is going to burst into your log cabin, so you don't really need a gun. Be like the English, learn to throw knives, use a hatchet, fence and disarm and you don't need a gun. |
It's our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to have a gun. The Founding Fathers put this as the second amendment against tyranny. Get rid of it, tyranny can prevail. Besides, if an intruder has a gun, and you don't, who do you think will be the victor?
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Link, the Hero of Time
Vice Admiral
Joined: 15 Sep 2001
Posts: 5581
Location: Kokori Forest, Hyrule
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| Tue May 17, 2005 10:28 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: |
It's our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to have a gun. The Founding Fathers put this as the second amendment against tyranny. Get rid of it, tyranny can prevail. Besides, if an intruder has a gun, and you don't, who do you think will be the victor? |
I'm guessing you've never had a gun pointed at you by a person with the intent to kill. Everyone believes it's a constitutional right until they have that experience on the street.
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Wed May 18, 2005 12:31 am |
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And the people who point guns at others, are virtually never legally in possession of that gun!! So what will more laws do?!?!
Jeez, guns obviously aren't the problem. For every gun you make illegal, that's one less legal gun to fight against criminals who, being criminals, will use a Gun anyways.
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Wed May 18, 2005 12:37 am |
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Whos complaining about us using guns now?
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Lord Borg
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 27 May 2003
Posts: 11214
Location: Vulcan Capital City, Vulcan
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| Wed May 18, 2005 2:11 am |
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Im all for having a gun to protect oneself. how ever, there needs to be some restirctions
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Wed May 18, 2005 2:14 am |
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Agreed LB. 
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Lord Borg
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 27 May 2003
Posts: 11214
Location: Vulcan Capital City, Vulcan
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| Wed May 18, 2005 2:20 am |
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As stated abouve, there are cerain weapons I dont see why the average person needs to be able to get
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webtaz99
Commodore
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
Posts: 1229
Location: The Other Side
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| Wed May 18, 2005 7:47 am |
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I have had a gun pointed at me - by a police officer.
And once again: the founding fathers understood that if the general populace was unable to defend itself, any government would find tyranny that much easier to achieve.
Guns are banned in China, so angry citizens are blowing up police stations with bombs.
Guns are a tool. It all depends on how they are used.
-------signature-------
"History is made at night! Character is who you are in the dark." (Lord John Whorfin)
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madlilnerd
Duchess of Dancemat
Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 5885
Location: Slough, England
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| Wed May 18, 2005 12:12 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | madlilnerd wrote: | | Om wrote: | | well, it speaks of a 'militia'. what about cops? what if only they had guns? i don't like guns at all of course, because they are made for killing. plus, the circumstances under which this ammendment was written was colonial america. times are different and guns are more advanced. violent crime would drop drastically if cops were the only ones allowed to have guns. |
Yeah, it's a really old law, and perhaps a little outdated. I mean, it's not like a bear or a native is going to burst into your log cabin, so you don't really need a gun. Be like the English, learn to throw knives, use a hatchet, fence and disarm and you don't need a gun. |
It's our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to have a gun. The Founding Fathers put this as the second amendment against tyranny. Get rid of it, tyranny can prevail. Besides, if an intruder has a gun, and you don't, who do you think will be the victor? |
The victor will be the more intelligent person. You can teach yourself to defend yourself against intruders and guns. If guns were harder to get hold of, then less intruders would have guns in the first place! Make your home less easy to access, lock doors and windows, plant spikey hedgerows, add alarms.
"Tyranny" won't prevail because Americans would lose their world image as people who love "Liberty and freedom"... and plus, when the French Revolution happened, half of the people who overthrew the tyranny didn't have guns and they still prevailed. You could always overthrow the government with petrol bombs, seeing as petrol is so cheap over there.
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Thu May 19, 2005 10:50 am |
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| LightningBoy wrote: | And the people who point guns at others, are virtually never legally in possession of that gun!! So what will more laws do?!?!
Jeez, guns obviously aren't the problem. For every gun you make illegal, that's one less legal gun to fight against criminals who, being criminals, will use a Gun anyways. |
I'm not saying lots of them are, but a number of these guns will have been stolen from people who have them legally.
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Thu May 19, 2005 1:40 pm |
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| Jeremy wrote: | | LightningBoy wrote: | And the people who point guns at others, are virtually never legally in possession of that gun!! So what will more laws do?!?!
Jeez, guns obviously aren't the problem. For every gun you make illegal, that's one less legal gun to fight against criminals who, being criminals, will use a Gun anyways. |
I'm not saying lots of them are, but a number of these guns will have been stolen from people who have them legally. |
Sure, but eliminating weapons will not prevent murder in any way. Criminals will still find guns, and those who can't, will find other means. Eliminating weapons is the easy way out, it's society who drives people to murder, that's an unnatural thing to do. Society needs to target and correct murderers before they do it.
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Thu May 19, 2005 2:17 pm |
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I know there will never be a means to stop the murder, but there will also never be a way of stopping murders (as you know). So it's a matter of deciding between the two, and I think stats show that having them illegal is better. But I can also understand the other side.
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Theresa
Lux Mihi Deus
Joined: 17 Jun 2001
Posts: 27256
Location: United States of America
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| Thu May 19, 2005 2:22 pm |
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I own two weapons. Gary has many more. We both use them for sport only. (Though I am going to go hunting this fall). I shouldn't have to give up my weapons because others can't control themselves. Besides, like has been said, the weapons that are used to kill are the ones gotten illegally. Making weapons illegal won't stop this, it'll merely make the innocents unarmed.
-------signature-------
Some of us fall by the wayside
And some of us soar to the stars
And some of us sail through our troubles
And some have to live with our scars
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Thu May 19, 2005 2:40 pm |
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Why stop the weapon, when the weapon can also be used to stop the murderer.
A murderer is going to murder, gun or not.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Thu May 19, 2005 11:10 pm |
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| Om wrote: | | well, it speaks of a 'militia'. what about cops? what if only they had guns? i don't like guns at all of course, because they are made for killing. plus, the circumstances under which this ammendment was written was colonial america. times are different and guns are more advanced. violent crime would drop drastically if cops were the only ones allowed to have guns. |
But it was still the intention of the Founders. The Constitution is not a living document, you know 
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Lord Borg
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 27 May 2003
Posts: 11214
Location: Vulcan Capital City, Vulcan
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| Fri May 20, 2005 2:01 am |
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T is right. making them Illegal will just make ppl like me, not have a gun. People (Gangsetc...) will STILL have guns. I dont see a problem with a rifle or 2. I do see problems with machine guns etc...
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Sat May 21, 2005 1:57 am |
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Hunting is not the only use for guns. Gun ownership and collecting can be a great hobby. It shouldn't be up to the government to regulate that.
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Sun May 22, 2005 12:31 pm |
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So how would you feel if you were a parent and your kid was shot by someone who had either stolen someone with a leaglised gun or had a liscence themselves? Would you think that it was ok, that your son should have had a gun to defend himself and it wasn't the person who killed him's fault, because if your son had a gun he could have used it?
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Theresa
Lux Mihi Deus
Joined: 17 Jun 2001
Posts: 27256
Location: United States of America
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| Sun May 22, 2005 8:42 pm |
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Two children are fighting over one toy. So instead of dealing with the problem, we take away all toys from all children.
Basic, yes, but still accurate.
-------signature-------
Some of us fall by the wayside
And some of us soar to the stars
And some of us sail through our troubles
And some have to live with our scars
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Sun May 22, 2005 10:37 pm |
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| Jeremy wrote: | | So how would you feel if you were a parent and your kid was shot by someone who had either stolen someone with a leaglised gun or had a liscence themselves? Would you think that it was ok, that your son should have had a gun to defend himself and it wasn't the person who killed him's fault, because if your son had a gun he could have used it? |
I would feel angry at the gunner. Not the gun.
Families of those who've lost loved ones in Car Accidents seldom petition to make cars illegal.
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webtaz99
Commodore
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
Posts: 1229
Location: The Other Side
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| Mon May 23, 2005 7:14 am |
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And while we're at it, let's get rid of paper - that stuff can give you a nasty cut. 
-------signature-------
"History is made at night! Character is who you are in the dark." (Lord John Whorfin)
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Mon May 23, 2005 8:55 am |
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| Theresa wrote: | Two children are fighting over one toy. So instead of dealing with the problem, we take away all toys from all children.
Basic, yes, but still accurate. |
So you think that we can stop people using guns irresponsibly? I'd be all for that, but it'd never work. As I said earlier though, I also know if guns were illegal there would still be some, although it'd be harder to get. I'm not either way on this, but I'm just mentioning other views.
And there's a difference between cuts and dying.
They don't petition to have cars removed but they often petition to increase road safety and also guns were designed originally for killing people, although now they can be used for target shooting and collecting.
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Theresa
Lux Mihi Deus
Joined: 17 Jun 2001
Posts: 27256
Location: United States of America
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| Mon May 23, 2005 10:43 am |
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And banning the right to have guns won't work, Jeremy. "Guns don't kill, people do.", isn't just a cliche.
-------signature-------
Some of us fall by the wayside
And some of us soar to the stars
And some of us sail through our troubles
And some have to live with our scars
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Mon May 23, 2005 12:17 pm |
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How come there is less of a death rate amounst most countries where guns are illegal?
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madlilnerd
Duchess of Dancemat
Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 5885
Location: Slough, England
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| Mon May 23, 2005 12:29 pm |
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If guns were legal in this country, I don't think half my family would be here now. My brother has anger management problems. He's exactly the kind of young male who would go out and shoot someone.
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