| Are you DISGUSTED with this decision? |
| OH YEAH. This is HORRIFYING. |
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50% |
[ 5 ] |
| Yes. |
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10% |
[ 1 ] |
| Somewhat. |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| No. It's a GOOD decision. |
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40% |
[ 4 ] |
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| Total Votes : 10 |
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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 Fri Apr 29, 2005 4:57 pm "One nation 'Under Your Belief System'" |
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Sean Hannity just reported in this last hour on his radio show that the Colorado School System is changing the phrase "One nation under God" into "One nation under your belief system." He didn't give specifics, but this DISGUSTS ME. I am SERIOUSLY considering forming a protest of youth and adults, especially youth, at the capital or wherever against this.
They say EVERY MORNING when we say the pledge at school what they say at I believe is EVERY school. That you don't have to say it, and that your right to not say it will be respected. Why the HELL, if you don't have to say it, do you have to CHANGE it! Is THAT not forcing a belief on one person? This is secularism gone TOO FAR. This needs to STOP.
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Fri Apr 29, 2005 5:04 pm |
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Never mind for now. I think I was mistaken. It was one school, well, school district, it looks like...
For now, don't post. I'm going to wait until tonight to get the full details.
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:51 pm |
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They can change it to whatever they want to, I will always say under God.
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Link, the Hero of Time
Vice Admiral
Joined: 15 Sep 2001
Posts: 5581
Location: Kokori Forest, Hyrule
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 12:15 am |
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This country is a melting pot of cultures. Christianity is not this countries main religion, But so many people treat it like it is.
Get over it.
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 12:16 am |
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Well considering Christianity is the main religion, and it is what the country is founded on.... Just saying  .
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 1:55 am |
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| Link, the Hero of Time wrote: | This country is a melting pot of cultures. Christianity is not this countries main religion, But so many people treat it like it is.
Get over it. |
Did you ever stop to do this crazy thing called consider when they said "God" they don't mean the Christian God?
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:45 am |
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| Puck wrote: | | Well considering Christianity is the main religion, and it is what the country is founded on.... Just saying . |
Christianity is not this country's main religion. And what about the other religions like wicca, where there is more than one God? What are they supposed to say? "One nation under Brude, Isis, Osiris....."? No, no, no, no, no, no. There is a seperation of church and state. We should be saying something like "One nation, indivisible...."
Do I think changing it to "one nation under your belief system" is a good idea? NO I DO NOT! If you're going to change it to better fit the differences, do it right and just take it out all together.
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Theresa
Lux Mihi Deus
Joined: 17 Jun 2001
Posts: 27256
Location: United States of America
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:38 am |
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Technically, since "Christian" is now such an all-encompassing word, we still are considered a "Christian Nation".
-------signature-------
Some of us fall by the wayside
And some of us soar to the stars
And some of us sail through our troubles
And some have to live with our scars
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Link, the Hero of Time
Vice Admiral
Joined: 15 Sep 2001
Posts: 5581
Location: Kokori Forest, Hyrule
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 9:41 am |
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| Founder wrote: |
Did you ever stop to do this crazy thing called consider when they said "God" they don't mean the Christian God? |
Ever stop to think how many other religions there are in this nation? Probably not.
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Dirt
Exercise Boy
Joined: 19 May 2003
Posts: 2086
Location: a tree
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 9:55 am |
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Just let people say whatever they want. I mean, if you say it but don't mean any of it then what is the use of that? The politcally correct stuff can be kinda silly sometimes,
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 4:50 pm |
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| Link, the Hero of Time wrote: | | Founder wrote: |
Did you ever stop to do this crazy thing called consider when they said "God" they don't mean the Christian God? |
Ever stop to think how many other religions there are in this nation? Probably not. |
Dude can you read? You just tried to use my argument. Nice job of stealing there. I'm saying did you ever stop to consider that when God is said that it doesn't mean the Christian God? Like if you're Islamic, you can say "Allah" or mean him. Did stop to think thats what I meant? "Probably not."
| 4evajaneway wrote: | | Christianity is not this country's main religion. And what about the other religions like wicca, where there is more than one God? What are they supposed to say? "One nation under Brude, Isis, Osiris....."? No, no, no, no, no, no. There is a seperation of church and state. We should be saying something like "One nation, indivisible...." |
Actually the Religions that believe in multiple Gods tend to believe that all those Gods are one God in various forms. So they can just say the name of their "Chief God" or if they want any other God.
This is MY point. You can say anything but to degrade it by getting rid of God is wrong.
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 5:20 pm |
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Umm... no, founder. But nice try. Most polythesiest religions believe in many seperate gods, and quite a few don't have one cheif god.
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 5:26 pm |
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| 4evajaneway wrote: | | Umm... no, founder. But nice try. Most polythesiest religions believe in many seperate gods, and quite a few don't have one cheif god. |
I know they believe in many Gods. I didn't say they didn't. And uh, you know this how? How many friends do you have that are polytheistic? Let me guess, you have several?  No, I've spoken with many and they all have said that. So um, no not "nice try".
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 6:42 pm |
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| 4evajaneway wrote: | | Puck wrote: | | Well considering Christianity is the main religion, and it is what the country is founded on.... Just saying . |
Christianity is not this country's main religion. And what about the other religions like wicca, where there is more than one God? What are they supposed to say? "One nation under Brude, Isis, Osiris....."? No, no, no, no, no, no. There is a seperation of church and state. We should be saying something like "One nation, indivisible...."
Do I think changing it to "one nation under your belief system" is a good idea? NO I DO NOT! If you're going to change it to better fit the differences, do it right and just take it out all together. |
Christianity is the countries main religion...Protestants make up 52% of the population, Catholics 24% Mormons 2%., Muslims and Jews, both 1%, others 10%, and athiests 10%.
That makes 76% of us Christian. I would say calling Christianity our main religion is safe  .
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Link, the Hero of Time
Vice Admiral
Joined: 15 Sep 2001
Posts: 5581
Location: Kokori Forest, Hyrule
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:10 pm |
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| Founder wrote: | | Dude can you read? You just tried to use my argument. Nice job of stealing there. I'm saying did you ever stop to consider that when God is said that it doesn't mean the Christian God? Like if you're Islamic, you can say "Allah" or mean him. Did stop to think thats what I meant? "Probably not." |
I tried to throw in another arument with the same point as yours said in a different fashion that was the basis of my argument.
Oh and it's not stealing if you dont copyright.
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:13 pm |
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| Link, the Hero of Time wrote: | | Founder wrote: | | Dude can you read? You just tried to use my argument. Nice job of stealing there. I'm saying did you ever stop to consider that when God is said that it doesn't mean the Christian God? Like if you're Islamic, you can say "Allah" or mean him. Did stop to think thats what I meant? "Probably not." |
I tried to throw in another arument with the same point as yours said in a different fashion that was the basis of my argument.
Oh and it's not stealing if you dont copyright. |
My point is that, it doesn't have to mean the Christian God. It can mean anyone. You can even not say that part if you don't believe in anyone. So why is this such a big deal? I'm trying to understand that.
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Ithildin
Junior Cadet
Joined: 28 Apr 2005
Posts: 16
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:15 pm |
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I for one think that it is more of an issue of forcing beliefs upon others to have the phrase "one nation under god". Not everyone believes in god you know. Christians may preside as the majority but it doesn't mean that their beliefs are above those of others. I agree, get over it!
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Hitchhiker
Rear Admiral
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 3514
Location: Ontario, Canada
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:18 pm |
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| Ithildin wrote: | | I for one think that it is more of an issue of forcing beliefs upon others to have the phrase "one nation under god". Not everyone believes in god you know. Christians may preside as the majority but it doesn't mean that their beliefs are above those of others. I agree, get over it! |
Meh, I think that in this case it would be a matter of political correctness gone too far. It's a matter of tradition more than belief system--we Canadians use the word "God" in our national anthem and haven't removed it, even though we have a diverse mosaic of cultures. The Pledge, and an anthem, are just symbols, nothing more. As such, they should be preserved rather than "updated."
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:22 pm |
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| Ithildin wrote: | | I for one think that it is more of an issue of forcing beliefs upon others to have the phrase "one nation under god". Not everyone believes in god you know. Christians may preside as the majority but it doesn't mean that their beliefs are above those of others. I agree, get over it! |
Excuse me? You are aware that you don't have to say God aren't you? No I won't get over it. You're pushing your beliefs on me and I won't have it.
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Jeff Miller
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 22 Nov 2001
Posts: 23947
Location: Mental Ward for the Mentaly Unstable 6th floor, Saint John's 1615 Delaware Longview Washington 98632
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| Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:50 pm |
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I say let them do what they want, what bad can it do? its just afew people expressing what they think or feel. I personally never did the pledge.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun May 01, 2005 12:23 pm |
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| Founder wrote: | | Link, the Hero of Time wrote: | | Founder wrote: | | Dude can you read? You just tried to use my argument. Nice job of stealing there. I'm saying did you ever stop to consider that when God is said that it doesn't mean the Christian God? Like if you're Islamic, you can say "Allah" or mean him. Did stop to think thats what I meant? "Probably not." |
I tried to throw in another arument with the same point as yours said in a different fashion that was the basis of my argument.
Oh and it's not stealing if you dont copyright. |
My point is that, it doesn't have to mean the Christian God. It can mean anyone. You can even not say that part if you don't believe in anyone. So why is this such a big deal? I'm trying to understand that. |
You are right. It does NOT simply mean the Christian God. That is an IGNORANT statement to make.
When Link said, "Get over it," that's a load of CRAP. What was this nation founded upon, anyways? Juedo-Christian values. What approximation of the country, as provided by "Puck," is Christian? 76% We are a Christian nation, and we are told that we DON'T HAVE TO SAY IT. Don't FORCE the belief that you can't have God in it on more than 76% of the population! That's not right!
Btw, it WAS simply a middle school.
| Founder wrote: | | Ithildin wrote: | | I for one think that it is more of an issue of forcing beliefs upon others to have the phrase "one nation under god". Not everyone believes in god you know. Christians may preside as the majority but it doesn't mean that their beliefs are above those of others. I agree, get over it! |
Excuse me? You are aware that you don't have to say God aren't you? No I won't get over it. You're pushing your beliefs on me and I won't have it. |
Exactly.
| Hitchhiker wrote: | | Ithildin wrote: | | I for one think that it is more of an issue of forcing beliefs upon others to have the phrase "one nation under god". Not everyone believes in god you know. Christians may preside as the majority but it doesn't mean that their beliefs are above those of others. I agree, get over it! |
Meh, I think that in this case it would be a matter of political correctness gone too far. It's a matter of tradition more than belief system--we Canadians use the word "God" in our national anthem and haven't removed it, even though we have a diverse mosaic of cultures. The Pledge, and an anthem, are just symbols, nothing more. As such, they should be preserved rather than "updated." |
Good points, HH.
And in the Denver Post article on this they called it a slight alteration. My God, what is this world coming to?[/quote]
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Zeke Zabertini
Captain
Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 4832
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| Sun May 01, 2005 3:22 pm |
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I still think we should just eliminate that McCarthy-era addendum. The phrase "under God" didn't even exist in the pledge until the red scare. It's a product of a nation's fear and hatred. It has no place in the pledge.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun May 01, 2005 3:37 pm |
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| Zeke Zabertini wrote: | | I still think we should just eliminate that McCarthy-era addendum. The phrase "under God" didn't even exist in the pledge until the red scare. It's a product of a nation's fear and hatred. It has no place in the pledge. |
WHAT? A product of a nation's FEAR and HATRED? What? NO. That was NOT the reason. You should study the real reason. It was to show the Soviet's our country's RELIGIOUSNESS, NOT hatred and such. We put it in there to show our nation's history and a principal difference between the USSR and USA.
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Sun May 01, 2005 4:14 pm |
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| Founder wrote: | | 4evajaneway wrote: | | Umm... no, founder. But nice try. Most polythesiest religions believe in many seperate gods, and quite a few don't have one cheif god. |
I know they believe in many Gods. I didn't say they didn't. And uh, you know this how? How many friends do you have that are polytheistic? Let me guess, you have several? No, I've spoken with many and they all have said that. So um, no not "nice try". |
I've BEEN a polytheist, so you wanna try that again?
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Sun May 01, 2005 4:16 pm |
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| 4evajaneway wrote: | | Founder wrote: | | 4evajaneway wrote: | | Umm... no, founder. But nice try. Most polythesiest religions believe in many seperate gods, and quite a few don't have one cheif god. |
I know they believe in many Gods. I didn't say they didn't. And uh, you know this how? How many friends do you have that are polytheistic? Let me guess, you have several? No, I've spoken with many and they all have said that. So um, no not "nice try". |
I've BEEN a polytheist, so you wanna try that again? |
Yes I do, because I talk to official polythiests. People who know the religion a lot more intimately. Who were raised with it and who are still that to this day. You're "BEEN" implies you no longer are.
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