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Jeff Miller
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 22 Nov 2001
Posts: 23947
Location: Mental Ward for the Mentaly Unstable 6th floor, Saint John's 1615 Delaware Longview Washington 98632
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 Tue Apr 19, 2005 11:36 am New Pope Elected on Second Day of Conclave |
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| Quote: | New Pope Elected on Second Day of Conclave
By WILLIAM J. KOLE
Associated Press Writer
White smoke billows from the chimney of the Sistine Chapel at the Vatican, Tuesday, April 19, 2005. White smoke indicates that the 265th Pope has been elected. (AP Photo/Domenico Stinellis)
VATICAN CITY (AP) -- White smoke poured from a chimney at the Vatican and bells tolled on Tuesday evening, announcing to the world that a new pope was elected in the first papal conclave of the new millennium.
Crowds in St. Peter's Square chanted: "Viva il Papa!" or "Long live the pope!"
"It's only been 24 hours, surprising how fast he was elected," Vatican Radio said, commenting on how the new pope was elected on the second day of the conclave, after just four or five ballots.
More pilgrims streamed into St. Peter's Square, waiting to find out who was selected. Prelates gathered on the roof of the Apostolic Palace.
A priests celebrates as white smoke billows from the chimney of the Sistine Chapel at the Vatican, Tuesday, April 19, 2005. White smoke indicates that the 265th Pope has been elected. (AP Photo/Luca Bruno)
The bells rang 6:04 p.m. (12:04 p.m. EDT) ending confusion over the smoke signal that had risen from the chimney of the Sistine Chapel. White smoke is used to announce the election of a new pope, along with the ringing of bells, which was added for this conclave.
Niels Hendrich, a 40-year-old salesman from Hamburg, Germany, jumped up and down with joy and called his father on a cell phone. "Habemus papam!" he shouted into the phone, using the Latin for: "We have a pope."
Antoinette Hastings, from Kent Island, Md., rose from her wheelchair, grasping her hands together and crying. She has artificial knees, making it tough to stand.
"I feel blessed, absolutely blessed," she said. "I just wish the rest of my family were here to experience this with me."
The 265th pontiff of the Roman Catholic Church succeeds John Paul II, who gained extraordinary popularity over a 26-year pontificate, history's third-longest papacy. Millions mourned him around the world in a tribute to his charisma.
Cardinals had faced a choice over whether to seek an older, skilled administrator who could serve as a "transitional" pope while the church absorbs John Paul's legacy, or a younger dynamic pastor and communicator - perhaps from Latin America or elsewhere in the developing world where the church is growing.
While John Paul, a Pole, was elected to challenge the communist system in place in Eastern Europe in 1978, the new pontiff faces new issues: the need for dialogue with Islam, the divisions between the wealthy north and the poor south as well as problems within his own church.
These include the priest sex-abuse scandals that have cost the church millions in settlements in the United States and elsewhere; coping with a chronic shortage of priests and nuns in the West; and halting the stream of people leaving a church indifferent to teachings they no longer find relevant.
Under John Paul, the church's central authority grew, often to dismay of bishops and rank-and-file Catholics around the world.
Even though John Paul appointed all but two of the men who elected the new pope, it was no guarantee that the new man would necessarily be in his mold.
Pope John XXIII was 77 when he was elected pope in 1958 and viewed as a transitional figure, but he called the Second Vatican Council that revolutionized the church from within and opened up its dialogue with non-Catholics.
The new pope will have to decide whether to keep up the kind of foreign travel that was a hallmark of John Paul's papacy, with his 104 pilgrimages abroad.
The new man may be locked into one foreign trip - the mid-August Catholic youth day gathering in Cologne, Germany. John Paul had agreed to visit and organizers have already spent millions of dollars in preparations. |
Even though I'm not religous I would like to see who is voted next and how this person will lead the church.
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| ~Tony Montana wrote: | | You know what you need people like me people for you to snub your nose at and point at saying there is a bad man. Well guess what This bad man is leaving. Say goodnight to the BAD MAN! |
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Valathous
The Canadian, eh
Joined: 31 Aug 2002
Posts: 19074
Location: Centre Bell
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 11:50 am |
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Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger of Germany is now Pope Benedict the XVI
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Theresa
Lux Mihi Deus
Joined: 17 Jun 2001
Posts: 27256
Location: United States of America
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 11:56 am |
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Wonder why he chose that name.
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Some of us fall by the wayside
And some of us soar to the stars
And some of us sail through our troubles
And some have to live with our scars
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Beta6
Commander
Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 475
Location: ~*City Of Angels*~
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 2:06 pm |
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I think my roommate told me (he is catholic) that they were thinking about a black guy. I don't remember his name, But I'm german.. so it's all good.
I don't think too many people would have been happy with having a black pope anyway. It is kinda like having a black president. I wouldn't mind at all, but I know there are still racial people.
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 4:42 pm |
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Yay! I am so excited! About to go up to church for a few minutes! 
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 4:46 pm |
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I wonder why they choose the names. What do they do for that? And yes, this is good news. I was expecting more than just 2 days. Who would've thought.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:09 pm |
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I am very happy. I should go to church tonight.
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There's a zipper for a reason, and it isn't to go take a piss 
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Dirt
Exercise Boy
Joined: 19 May 2003
Posts: 2086
Location: a tree
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:26 pm |
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| Quote: | Papal hopeful is a former Hitler Youth
Justin Sparks, Munich, John Follain and Christopher Morgan, Rome
THE wartime past of a leading German contender to succeed John Paul II may return to haunt him as cardinals begin voting in the Sistine Chapel tomorrow to choose a new leader for 1 billion Catholics.
Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, whose strong defence of Catholic orthodoxy has earned him a variety of sobriquets � including �the enforcer�, �the panzer cardinal� and �God�s rottweiler� � is expected to poll around 40 votes in the first ballot as conservatives rally behind him.
Although far short of the requisite two-thirds majority of the 115 votes, this would almost certainly give Ratzinger, 78 yesterday, an early lead in the voting. Liberals have yet to settle on a rival candidate who could come close to his tally.
Unknown to many members of the church, however, Ratzinger�s past includes brief membership of the Hitler Youth movement and wartime service with a German army anti- aircraft unit.
Although there is no suggestion that he was involved in any atrocities, his service may be contrasted by opponents with the attitude of John Paul II, who took part in anti-Nazi theatre performances in his native Poland and in 1986 became the first pope to visit Rome�s synagogue.
�John Paul was hugely appreciated for what he did for and with the Jewish people,� said Lord Janner, head of the Holocaust Education Trust, who is due to attend ceremonies today to mark the 60th anniversary of the liberation of the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp.
�If they were to appoint someone who was on the other side in the war, he would start at a disadvantage, although it wouldn�t mean in the long run he wouldn�t be equally understanding of the concerns of the Jewish world.�
The son of a rural Bavarian police officer, Ratzinger was six when Hitler came to power in 1933. His father, also called Joseph, was an anti-Nazi whose attempts to rein in Hitler�s Brown Shirts forced the family to move home several times.
In 1937 Ratzinger�s father retired and the family moved to Traunstein, a staunchly Catholic town in Bavaria close to the F�hrer�s mountain retreat in Berchtesgaden. He joined the Hitler Youth aged 14, shortly after membership was made compulsory in 1941.
He quickly won a dispensation on account of his training at a seminary. �Ratzinger was only briefly a member of the Hitler Youth and not an enthusiastic one,� concluded John Allen, his biographer.
Two years later Ratzinger was enrolled in an anti-aircraft unit that protected a BMW factory making aircraft engines. The workforce included slaves from Dachau concentration camp.
Ratzinger has insisted he never took part in combat or fired a shot � adding that his gun was not even loaded � because of a badly infected finger. He was sent to Hungary, where he set up tank traps and saw Jews being herded to death camps. He deserted in April 1944 and spent a few weeks in a prisoner of war camp.
He has since said that although he was opposed to the Nazi regime, any open resistance would have been futile � comments echoed this weekend by his elder brother Georg, a retired priest ordained along with the cardinal in 1951.
�Resistance was truly impossible,� Georg Ratzinger said. �Before we were conscripted, one of our teachers said we should fight and become heroic Nazis and another told us not to worry as only one soldier in a thousand was killed. But neither of us ever used a rifle against the enemy.�
Some locals in Traunstein, like Elizabeth Lohner, 84, whose brother-in-law was sent to Dachau as a conscientious objector, dismiss such suggestions. �It was possible to resist, and those people set an example for others,� she said. �The Ratzingers were young and had made a different choice.�
In 1937 another family a few hundred yards away in Traunstein hid Hans Braxenthaler, a local resistance fighter. SS troops repeatedly searched homes in the area looking for the fugitive and his fellow conspirators.
�When he was betrayed and the Nazis came for him, Braxenthaler shot himself because he knew he couldn�t escape,� said Frieda Meyer, 82, Ratzinger�s neighbour and childhood friend. �Even though they had tortured him in Dachau concentration camp he refused to give up his resistance efforts.�
Despite question marks over Ratzinger�s wartime conduct, the main obstacle to his prospects in the conclave � the assembly of cardinals to elect the new pope � is the conservative stance he has adopted as guardian of Catholic orthodoxy since John Paul named him to head the congregation for the doctrine of the faith in 1981.
His condemnations are legion � of women priests, married priests, dissident theologians and homosexuals, whom he has declared to be suffering from an �objective disorder�.
He upset many Jews with a statement in 1987 that Jewish history and scripture reach fulfilment only in Christ � a position denounced by critics as �theological anti-semitism�. He made more enemies among other religions in 2000, when he signed a document, Dominus Jesus, in which he argued: �Only in the Catholic church is there eternal salvation�.
Some of his staunchest critics are in Germany. A recent poll in Der Spiegel, the news magazine, showed opponents of a Ratzinger papacy outnumbered supporters by 36% to 29%.
As one western cardinal who was in two minds about him put it: �He would probably be a great pope, but I have no idea how I would explain his election back home.�
One liberal theologian,when asked what he thought of a Ratzinger papacy, was more direct: �It fills me with horror.�
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Hate to say I told you so Aaron 
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:34 pm |
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Source, please?
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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nadia
cookie
Joined: 08 Apr 2005
Posts: 8560
Location: Australia
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:36 pm |
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Did they end up picking the black guy?
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:39 pm |
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no, they didn't pick the cardinal from nigeria
and I heard the same thing RM the artical is on my MSN homepage.
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There's a zipper for a reason, and it isn't to go take a piss
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:41 pm |
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I find that hard to believe, but if it's true, I would think that that's in the past. Besides, he was youth then, and hasn't done anything since.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Hitchhiker
Rear Admiral
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 3514
Location: Ontario, Canada
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:47 pm |
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Membership in the Hitler Youth was compulsory for all German youths at the age of 14 or above. Furthermore, he did desert the army after being drafted.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XVI
At least 78 cardinals saw this man as a the proper leader for the Roman Catholic Church. They were probably aware of his past too, but his high position is evidence of his attitudes--actions speak louder than words.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:48 pm |
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| Hitchhiker wrote: | Membership in the Hitler Youth was compulsory for all German youths at the age of 14 or above. Furthermore, he did desert the army after being drafted.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XVI
At least 78 cardinals saw this man as a the proper leader for the Roman Catholic Church. They were probably aware of his past too, but his high position is evidence of his attitudes--actions speak louder than words. |
You are right in that last paragraph, and thanks for clearing that up.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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zero
Rear Admiral
Joined: 03 Apr 2005
Posts: 4566
Location: Texas
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:52 pm |
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I'm just happy they were able to replace the previous pope so quickly. That is amazing.
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Zeke Zabertini
Captain
Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 4832
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:53 pm |
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It's not that odd. I don't like Ratzinger from what I've heard of him, but I'm not Catholic either, so I'm not going to worry about it.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:57 pm |
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| Zeke Zabertini wrote: | | It's not that odd. I don't like Ratzinger from what I've heard of him, but I'm not Catholic either, so I'm not going to worry about it. |
And you're not a Conservative He's a very conservative person, speaking even about, "He spoke of tendencies he considered dangers to the faith: sects, ideologies like Marxism, liberalism, atheism, agnosticism and relativism � the ideology that there are no absolute truths" (FOX News).
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Zeke Zabertini
Captain
Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 4832
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:00 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | And you're not a Conservative He's a very conservative person, speaking even about, "He spoke of tendencies he considered dangers to the faith: sects, ideologies like Marxism, liberalism, atheism, agnosticism and relativism � the ideology that there are no absolute truths" (FOX News). |
Yeah, statements like that do tend to drive off my support.
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:00 pm |
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Yeah, I don't like this guy either. And I'm a catholic. Even if I wasn't, I'd still be concerned. He's in a position of power.
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Zeke Zabertini
Captain
Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 4832
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:02 pm |
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| 4evajaneway wrote: | | Yeah, I don't like this guy either. And I'm a catholic. Even if I wasn't, I'd still be concerned. He's in a position of power. |
Random jibe: Yeah, your religious leader hates your political ideology. How does that make you feel?
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:19 pm |
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| Zeke Zabertini wrote: | | 4evajaneway wrote: | | Yeah, I don't like this guy either. And I'm a catholic. Even if I wasn't, I'd still be concerned. He's in a position of power. |
Random jibe: Yeah, your religious leader hates your political ideology. How does that make you feel? |
Swell....
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Link, the Hero of Time
Vice Admiral
Joined: 15 Sep 2001
Posts: 5581
Location: Kokori Forest, Hyrule
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:43 pm |
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An extremely conservative pope, great that's all the church needs now. This will chase away a large amount of worshippers, alienate the scientific Roman Catholics and drive away many priests.
Sometimes a wonder about Roman Catholoicism.
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Starbuck
faster...
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 8715
Location: between chaos and melody
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:09 pm |
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yeah.... unfortunately, I have two very right-wing conservative parents....
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B'Elanna Torres 7 of 9
Ballet Babe
Joined: 20 Aug 2001
Posts: 3642
Location: DISNEY WORLD
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:32 pm |
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im so glad i was able to catch it on tv! My last class was canceled so i came home and layed down on the couch to take a nap. I turned the tv on, and just like 15 minutes prior to that, they had seen the white smoke, so i ended up watching the whole thing on tv! It was good times.
It's cool becuase 2 summers ago I was in the Vatican City, walking around in that exact square where thousands were gathered to greet the new Pope! Just kinda cool i though!
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"...I want so much more than they've got planned."*Belle Reprise* Beauty and the Beast
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Apr 19, 2005 10:22 pm |
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| Link, the Hero of Time wrote: | An extremely conservative pope, great that's all the church needs now. This will chase away a large amount of worshippers, alienate the scientific Roman Catholics and drive away many priests.
Sometimes a wonder about Roman Catholoicism. |
I think his liberalism really means abortion, gay marriage, etc, actually.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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