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Solitary Poet
Captain
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 805
Location: Lancaster (Dallas), Texas
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 Sun Nov 14, 2004 10:20 pm Did anyone actually win the election? Well did they? |
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I find it funny that that half of all Republicrats actually think that they won this and what�s worse is the fact that the other half of them actually think they lost. It doesn�t really matter who becomes the President-the office that we call the presidency doesn�t even really exist, neither does democracy for that matter (the term �democracy� is still used even thought it is nothing more than a meaningless anachronism). The President in particular is very much a figurehead though he holds no real power whatsoever. He is apparently chosen by the people (an elusion), but the qualities he is required to display are not those of leadership but those of finely judged outrage. For this reason the President is always a controversial choice, always an infuriating but fascinating character. His job is not to wield power but to draw attention away from it. On those criteria Clinton and George W. Bush are two of the most successful Presidents the U.S. has ever had. Very, very few people realize that the President and the Government have virtually no power at all, and of these few people ever fewer know whence ultimate political power is wielded. Most of the others secretly believe that the ultimate decision-making process is handles by the Illuminati. They couldn�t be more wrong. There has never been a President who has ever discovered the truth, at least not one that survived it�s discovery. The moment a President or any other such figure of �power� discovers the truth is the moment he or she dies. Only the people with the least influence of all can survive knowing what the truth is, only people with absolutely no hope of ever changing anything of any real importance (such as the people of this board) can live through the curse of the revelation of where the true power lies. This why I have decided to tell you that I am, as I type this, on the verge of discovering this truth and I believe that it is nothing that we have ever dreamed of, something so farfetched that at the most only one of the people I ever tell will ever believe it.
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�STARGATE: Highlander�, Is Methos an Egyptian god?
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:17 pm |
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What the heck? Half the Republicans do NOT think that we lost! We did win, stop doubting it and saying these things to help you in your thought that Bush stole the election! We won--and we won FAIR AND SQUARE! Get over it!
::Sings "Get over it! Get over it!"::
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Solitary Poet
Captain
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 805
Location: Lancaster (Dallas), Texas
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:24 pm |
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Sorry, skimmed over that. But either way, get over it. There's no reason to put anything about those who think that Bush lost, when he clearly won.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:39 pm |
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Seriously RM, someone is trying to look beyond partisan lines and make a real world analysis of something, and all you hear is "republican republican republican george w bush" in your head. Try to look at what hes saying without thinking anything about republicans or democrats. He has good points about our governmental system. The president IS a figurehead. Every single thing he does has to get approved by congress, so he cant do anything on his own. Plain and simple. Open your mind RM.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:40 pm |
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| Defiant wrote: | | Seriously RM, someone is trying to look beyond partisan lines and make a real world analysis of something, and all you hear is "republican republican republican george w bush" in your head. Try to look at what hes saying without thinking anything about republicans or democrats. He has good points about our governmental system. The president IS a figurehead. Every single thing he does has to get approved by congress, so he cant do anything on his own. Plain and simple. Open your mind RM. |
Well, yes, that is true. But the stuff about did they really win the election? THAT is balony.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:42 pm |
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And btw, I'm not a Republican partisan  I'm supporting the Jedi Party for President in '08  Read the sig
Last edited by Republican_Man on Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:43 pm |
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Well apparently even if you told me the "truth" I still would not know it seeing as I will be an elected official one day, perhaps even President. Or does that mean if you told me the "truth" I would die straight away?
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:57 am |
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I am seriously considering becoming a politician by career. I am having trouble thinking of what major to pursue here at college. Im thinking political science. I dunno.
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Arellia
The Quiet One
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 4425
Location: Dallas, TX
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| Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:01 pm |
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...the President has few formal powers. However, he can veto any bill, and do just about anything he wants diplomatically (There are limits, but within reason, it works). The president's true power is persuassion of congress and the people. Which is formidable. Poet, in essence, some of what you say is true. However, I think it's a little over-stated. The president IS more of a figurehead, but since the media presence, his power has grown to what we see it as today. Though they are FAR from having absolute power. And we (Republicans) DID win the house and senate, besides the presidency. That's a pretty clear win.
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Sam Kenobi
Not a Duke
Joined: 13 Jun 2003
Posts: 10373
Location: The 'Verse
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| Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:07 pm |
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wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? 
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Mon Nov 15, 2004 5:44 pm |
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| Triam_Paris wrote: | | wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? |
Conspiracy?
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Tue Nov 16, 2004 3:49 am |
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The X Files is a silly show.
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Jeremy
J's Guy
Joined: 03 Oct 2002
Posts: 7823
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
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| Tue Nov 16, 2004 4:18 am |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | Triam_Paris wrote: | | wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? |
Conspiracy? |
That's what is basically being said in the first post. The president doesn't have control of the country but rather some other people, who aren't mentioned and who hide it.
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sabertooth1217
UPN Boycotter
Joined: 21 Jun 2003
Posts: 11484
Location: Texas
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| Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:19 am |
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| Jeremy wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | Triam_Paris wrote: | | wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? |
Conspiracy? |
That's what is basically being said in the first post. The president doesn't have control of the country but rather some other people, who aren't mentioned and who hide it. |
If the president really isn't in command of the United States, who is? I know that everything that the president is done, BUT it can be rejected from congress, I didn't think that it had to "Go though" the congress for anything to happen. I do agree with solitary poet when he said that the president is just someone to take the blame, to keep the eyes off who is really in charge.... but who is?
| Republican_Man wrote: | | And btw, I'm not a Republican partisan I'm supporting the Jedi Party for President in '08 Read the sig |
Tisk Tisk... You would think that you would stop spamming the very same thing after a month or so...
| Defiant wrote: | | The X Files is a silly show. |
Same goes for you....MARK!
| Republican_Man wrote: | | Triam_Paris wrote: | | wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? |
Conspiracy? |
That�s all the United States government really is, I still think to this day that there was a conspiracy behind 9-11, but I really don't really like getting into that again. Heck... Have you ever heard of the Skulls... If my history is right, both Bush's were in it...
| Exalya wrote: | | ...the President has few formal powers. However, he can veto any bill, and do just about anything he wants diplomatically (There are limits, but within reason, it works). The president's true power is persuassion of congress and the people. Which is formidable. Poet, in essence, some of what you say is true. However, I think it's a little over-stated. The president IS more of a figurehead, but since the media presence, his power has grown to what we see it as today. Though they are FAR from having absolute power. And we (Republicans) DID win the house and senate, besides the presidency. That's a pretty clear win. |
So the congress is in charge of the United States? Who then is the Master and Chief of the armied forces?
*And yes, and sad as I have to say it... Republicans did win the election. Bottom line.
| Defiant wrote: | | I am seriously considering becoming a politician by career. I am having trouble thinking of what major to pursue here at college. Im thinking political science. I dunno. |
Interesting, I would never in any circumstance think about that as my major, I would rather not argue all of my life for things that won't really affect the middle class. I also prefer not to lie when I have the chance�
| Republican_Man wrote: | What the heck? Half the Republicans do NOT think that we lost! We did win, stop doubting it and saying these things to help you in your thought that Bush stole the election! We won--and we won FAIR AND SQUARE! Get over it!
::Sings "Get over it! Get over it!":: |
Maybe you could try to talk as a mature adult some time? Just an idea...
| Republican_Man wrote: |
Sorry, skimmed over that. But either way, get over it. There's no reason to put anything about those who think that Bush lost, when he clearly won. |
Typical Republican reads over something then tries to back out of it like it didn't happen. I doubt you "Read Over it" you just assumed that he was trying to make fun of the Republican Party. At least Democrats can admit that we lost something when we did. I wonder what it would have been like if JK won?
| Quote: | | On those criteria Clinton and George W. Bush are two of the most successful Presidents the U.S. has ever had. |
Eh I see what your saying... but that may only be because the entire nation was split during BOTH of there terms.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:01 pm |
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| chakotay99 wrote: | | Jeremy wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | Triam_Paris wrote: | | wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? |
Conspiracy? |
That's what is basically being said in the first post. The president doesn't have control of the country but rather some other people, who aren't mentioned and who hide it. |
If the president really isn't in command of the United States, who is? I know that everything that the president is done, BUT it can be rejected from congress, I didn't think that it had to "Go though" the congress for anything to happen. I do agree with solitary poet when he said that the president is just someone to take the blame, to keep the eyes off who is really in charge.... but who is?
The President is, but there is a balance of power.
| Republican_Man wrote: | | And btw, I'm not a Republican partisan I'm supporting the Jedi Party for President in '08 Read the sig |
Tisk Tisk... You would think that you would stop spamming the very same thing after a month or so...
Ever read this?
| Defiant wrote: | | Seriously RM, someone is trying to look beyond partisan lines and make a real world analysis of something, and all you hear is "republican republican republican george w bush" in your head. Try to look at what hes saying without thinking anything about republicans or democrats. He has good points about our governmental system. The president IS a figurehead. Every single thing he does has to get approved by congress, so he cant do anything on his own. Plain and simple. Open your mind RM. |
It was a jokeful response.
| Defiant wrote: | | The X Files is a silly show. |
Same goes for you....MARK!
| Republican_Man wrote: | | Triam_Paris wrote: | | wait... you're just coming to the realization that it's all a conspiracy? didn't you ever watch the X-Files? |
Conspiracy? |
That�s all the United States government really is, I still think to this day that there was a conspiracy behind 9-11, but I really don't really like getting into that again. Heck... Have you ever heard of the Skulls... If my history is right, both Bush's were in it...
Never heard of the skulls, but you REALLY think that there was a conspiracy behind 9-11 with the President and his administration! COME ON, CHAKOTAY! Don't make such horrible accusations, and with no proof to boot! SERIOUSLY!! It's just evil.
| Exalya wrote: | | ...the President has few formal powers. However, he can veto any bill, and do just about anything he wants diplomatically (There are limits, but within reason, it works). The president's true power is persuassion of congress and the people. Which is formidable. Poet, in essence, some of what you say is true. However, I think it's a little over-stated. The president IS more of a figurehead, but since the media presence, his power has grown to what we see it as today. Though they are FAR from having absolute power. And we (Republicans) DID win the house and senate, besides the presidency. That's a pretty clear win. |
So the congress is in charge of the United States? Who then is the Master and Chief of the armied forces?
*And yes, and sad as I have to say it... Republicans did win the election. Bottom line.
No. The President really wields the power, but there is something called the BALANCE OF POWER. Ever heard of it? And the President is the Commander in Chief, but he doesn't have the power to declare war. He can only do a police action w/out Congress approving it.
| Defiant wrote: | | I am seriously considering becoming a politician by career. I am having trouble thinking of what major to pursue here at college. Im thinking political science. I dunno. |
Interesting, I would never in any circumstance think about that as my major, I would rather not argue all of my life for things that won't really affect the middle class. I also prefer not to lie when I have the chance�
| Republican_Man wrote: | What the heck? Half the Republicans do NOT think that we lost! We did win, stop doubting it and saying these things to help you in your thought that Bush stole the election! We won--and we won FAIR AND SQUARE! Get over it!
::Sings "Get over it! Get over it!":: |
Maybe you could try to talk as a mature adult some time? Just an idea...
Oh my gosh! Come on! The person was writing about the possibility that Bush did not win. That's NOT the wrong way to respond. You should wise up, not me. Come on! Do you not understand the premise of the topic "Who Really Won the Election?" Huh?
| Republican_Man wrote: |
Sorry, skimmed over that. But either way, get over it. There's no reason to put anything about those who think that Bush lost, when he clearly won. |
Typical Republican reads over something then tries to back out of it like it didn't happen. I doubt you "Read Over it" you just assumed that he was trying to make fun of the Republican Party. At least Democrats can admit that we lost something when we did. I wonder what it would have been like if JK won?
Oh come on! Don't sink to an attack of that level (and you're the one telling me to grow up  ). I read it, but I misread the Republicrats, etc. I really did! Don't be an idiot.
And yes, if Kerry won, I would think that we would be in trouble, but I would BELIEVE it and I would RALLY behind our President--regardless. And I'll admit that Salazar won my state in the Senate Race.
| Quote: | | On those criteria Clinton and George W. Bush are two of the most successful Presidents the U.S. has ever had. |
Eh I see what your saying... but that may only be because the entire nation was split during BOTH of there terms. |
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:08 pm |
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| Quote: | | Typical Republican reads over something then tries to back out of it like it didn't happen. I doubt you "Read Over it" you just assumed that he was trying to make fun of the Republican Party. At least Democrats can admit that we lost something when we did. I wonder what it would have been like if JK won? |
Democrats admitting they lost!!!!???? 
C'mon C99. Democrats are still b****ing about voter fraud and this and that. Ya'll are far from admitting ya'll lost.
How would it be like if JK won? One word. Bad.
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Arellia
The Quiet One
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 4425
Location: Dallas, TX
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:49 am |
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Actually...congress is the most powerful branch of government, if it sets to it. Congress can trump even the president if it's totally necessary. The problem we have are fillibusters, and conflicting sides. Otherwise, congress is huge. President can't implement domestic policy, he can only suggest and approve it. President makes the budget (Well, the OMB makes it) and then congress and their people revise it some, and then it's passed. Congress is "The 400-pound gorilla of the political arena." (Forget who said that, but I had to memorize it for Political Science ) The President commands the military, but he gets approval through congress. Treaties are approved by congress. And federal judges. And the cabinet... yes, the President proposes most of the stuff I mentioned, and most of it gets through, however, congress can stop almost anything it wants. Almost being the operative word.
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TrekkieMage
Office Junkie
Joined: 17 Oct 2004
Posts: 5335
Location: Hiding
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 5:42 pm |
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| Exalya wrote: | | Actually...congress is the most powerful branch of government, if it sets to it. Congress can trump even the president if it's totally necessary. The problem we have are fillibusters, and conflicting sides. Otherwise, congress is huge. President can't implement domestic policy, he can only suggest and approve it. President makes the budget (Well, the OMB makes it) and then congress and their people revise it some, and then it's passed. Congress is "The 400-pound gorilla of the political arena." (Forget who said that, but I had to memorize it for Political Science ) The President commands the military, but he gets approval through congress. Treaties are approved by congress. And federal judges. And the cabinet... yes, the President proposes most of the stuff I mentioned, and most of it gets through, however, congress can stop almost anything it wants. Almost being the operative word. |
Yep. Article I of the Constitution.
Got a test on it tomorrow.
The only thing the president can really do is a pocket veto. And even that's rare.
http://www.usconstitution.net
I think that's one of the most complete sites...They really outline the Constitution very accuratly.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:00 pm |
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| Exalya wrote: | | Actually...congress is the most powerful branch of government, if it sets to it. Congress can trump even the president if it's totally necessary. The problem we have are fillibusters, and conflicting sides. Otherwise, congress is huge. President can't implement domestic policy, he can only suggest and approve it. President makes the budget (Well, the OMB makes it) and then congress and their people revise it some, and then it's passed. Congress is "The 400-pound gorilla of the political arena." (Forget who said that, but I had to memorize it for Political Science ) The President commands the military, but he gets approval through congress. Treaties are approved by congress. And federal judges. And the cabinet... yes, the President proposes most of the stuff I mentioned, and most of it gets through, however, congress can stop almost anything it wants. Almost being the operative word. |
First off, that is a DECLARATION OF WAR that he needs approval for. Vietnam wasn't a true "war" in the sense--it was a police action. However, if you add it up, the President is the most powerful single man in the world, but yes, the Congress MAY be more powerful, but I think that the Legislative and Execuitive brances are the strongest. Remember: Legislative makes the laws, Executive passes and enforces the laws, and the Judicial system interprets the law (or so it's supposed to).
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Arellia
The Quiet One
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 4425
Location: Dallas, TX
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:05 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: |
First off, that is a DECLARATION OF WAR that he needs approval for. Vietnam wasn't a true "war" in the sense--it was a police action. However, if you add it up, the President is the most powerful single man in the world, but yes, the Congress MAY be more powerful, but I think that the Legislative and Execuitive brances are the strongest. Remember: Legislative makes the laws, Executive passes and enforces the laws, and the Judicial system interprets the law (or so it's supposed to). |
Actually, he needs to alert congress of troop deployment within a certain amount of days. Something they came up with during 'Nam. And this war isn't a true war either, as I'm sure you know. And Congress is legislature. Whether or not it is the most powerful isn't exactly the argument. It is supposed to be most powerful, and was built to be most powerful. For practical purposes, unless we get rid of the fillibusters, it will continue to dawdle on issues. I won't argue with you on the one part of it, though...the President is the most powerful individual person, in a number of respects.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:41 pm |
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| Exalya wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: |
First off, that is a DECLARATION OF WAR that he needs approval for. Vietnam wasn't a true "war" in the sense--it was a police action. However, if you add it up, the President is the most powerful single man in the world, but yes, the Congress MAY be more powerful, but I think that the Legislative and Execuitive brances are the strongest. Remember: Legislative makes the laws, Executive passes and enforces the laws, and the Judicial system interprets the law (or so it's supposed to). |
Actually, he needs to alert congress of troop deployment within a certain amount of days. Something they came up with during 'Nam. And this war isn't a true war either, as I'm sure you know. And Congress is legislature. Whether or not it is the most powerful isn't exactly the argument. It is supposed to be most powerful, and was built to be most powerful. For practical purposes, unless we get rid of the fillibusters, it will continue to dawdle on issues. I won't argue with you on the one part of it, though...the President is the most powerful individual person, in a number of respects. |
If you're talking the War in Iraq, it IS a real war. Congress approved it and declared War with Iraq. But yeah.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Arellia
The Quiet One
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 4425
Location: Dallas, TX
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 8:00 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | Exalya wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: |
First off, that is a DECLARATION OF WAR that he needs approval for. Vietnam wasn't a true "war" in the sense--it was a police action. However, if you add it up, the President is the most powerful single man in the world, but yes, the Congress MAY be more powerful, but I think that the Legislative and Execuitive brances are the strongest. Remember: Legislative makes the laws, Executive passes and enforces the laws, and the Judicial system interprets the law (or so it's supposed to). |
Actually, he needs to alert congress of troop deployment within a certain amount of days. Something they came up with during 'Nam. And this war isn't a true war either, as I'm sure you know. And Congress is legislature. Whether or not it is the most powerful isn't exactly the argument. It is supposed to be most powerful, and was built to be most powerful. For practical purposes, unless we get rid of the fillibusters, it will continue to dawdle on issues. I won't argue with you on the one part of it, though...the President is the most powerful individual person, in a number of respects. |
If you're talking the War in Iraq, it IS a real war. Congress approved it and declared War with Iraq. But yeah. |
...declare true war? From what I've been told, we haven't declared "war" since WWII...
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed Nov 17, 2004 8:23 pm |
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| Exalya wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | Exalya wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: |
First off, that is a DECLARATION OF WAR that he needs approval for. Vietnam wasn't a true "war" in the sense--it was a police action. However, if you add it up, the President is the most powerful single man in the world, but yes, the Congress MAY be more powerful, but I think that the Legislative and Execuitive brances are the strongest. Remember: Legislative makes the laws, Executive passes and enforces the laws, and the Judicial system interprets the law (or so it's supposed to). |
Actually, he needs to alert congress of troop deployment within a certain amount of days. Something they came up with during 'Nam. And this war isn't a true war either, as I'm sure you know. And Congress is legislature. Whether or not it is the most powerful isn't exactly the argument. It is supposed to be most powerful, and was built to be most powerful. For practical purposes, unless we get rid of the fillibusters, it will continue to dawdle on issues. I won't argue with you on the one part of it, though...the President is the most powerful individual person, in a number of respects. |
If you're talking the War in Iraq, it IS a real war. Congress approved it and declared War with Iraq. But yeah. |
...declare true war? From what I've been told, we haven't declared "war" since WWII... |
Not true. Korea, Afghanistan, and Iraq, for instance, were REAL wars. Those are just things that the libs like to drive through you.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Arellia
The Quiet One
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 4425
Location: Dallas, TX
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| Thu Nov 18, 2004 12:00 am |
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| Republican_Man wrote: |
...declare true war? From what I've been told, we haven't declared "war" since WWII... |
Not true. Korea, Afghanistan, and Iraq, for instance, were REAL wars. Those are just things that the libs like to drive through you.[/quote]
...hmn. Well, I have to check that out, now, unfortunately, 'cause either you or my teacher is incorrect. (...and yes, I will check it out...not that I don't trust ya', but I have to find out myself anyway..)
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Not the doctor... yet
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