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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
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 Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:59 pm Kerry's Cambodia Comment Key to New Ad |
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| Quote: |
Kerry's Cambodia Comment Key to New Ad
Friday, August 27, 2004
By Liza Porteus
NEW YORK � The group responsible for turning John Kerry's Vietnam War service into a major campaign issue released a new ad Friday, accusing the Democratic presidential nominee of being "deceitful" for suggesting he spent Christmas Eve, 1968, in Cambodia.
The new spot from Swift Boat Veterans for Truth (search) is just the latest twist in a story that has dominated campaign news coverage almost since Kerry accepted the nomination last month.
Also getting into the act Friday was John Glenn (search) � the former Ohio senator, one-time presidential candidate and the first American to orbit the earth � who condemned the anti-Kerry commercials.
Glenn, a decorated Marine, said the ads attack all those who defended the United States in wars and discussed the need to get back to the real issues at stake.
'Never in Cambodia'
Called "Never in Cambodia," the ad features Stephen Gardner, who served under Kerry.
"I spent more time on John Kerry's boat than any other crew member," Gardner says in the ad. "John Kerry hasn't been honest, he's been deceitful. John Kerry claims that he spent Christmas in 1968 in Cambodia and that is categorically a lie. Not in December, not in January. We were never in Cambodia on a secret mission, ever."
A recently released book, "Unfit for Command," co-authored by Swift Boat Veterans spokesman John O'Neill (search), raises questions about Kerry's claims that he was in Cambodia on Christmas Eve, 1968, at a time when the U.S. government insisted that there was no American military presence in that country.
In an Oct. 14, 1979, letter to the editor of the Boston Herald, Kerry wrote: "I remember spending Christmas Eve of 1968 five miles across the Cambodian border being shot at by our South Vietnamese allies who were drunk and celebrating Christmas. The absurdity of almost being killed by our own allies in a country in which President Nixon claimed there were no American troops was very real."
Kerry also mentioned the incident in a speech on the Senate floor on March 27, 1986.
"It's a total and complete lie. It's a total fabrication," O'Neill recently told FOX News. "He's said it 50 times and yet in his new book, he's in a base in Vietnam dreaming of sugar plums."
Kerry has said on the record that he was mistaken in his recollections and has since said he was on a river near Cambodia, not actually in the country.
Growing Flap Over Kerry's Service
The Cambodia issue is just one of many Vietnam-related tangles the Massachusetts senator has found himself in as Swift Boat Veterans for Truth continues its campaign.
The group also challenges the validity of Kerry's various medals and slams the Boston Brahmin for claiming � once he returned from service � that many Americans who served in Vietnam had committed atrocities.
Kerry has accused the Bush-Cheney re-election campaign of using the group as a front to run a "fear and smear" campaign.
"All the guys who were with me on my boat, all the guys who were with me in the specific action where they could see it and do it, absolutely document what I said," Kerry said during a campaign stop Thursday. "And as you've seen in the last few days, you're now learning about the lie that's been put out there and how it's been put out there
The Kerry-Edwards camp this week launched its own 60-second television ad entitled, "Shame," a reworking of an Internet ad, entitled "Old Tricks," that the campaign released on Saturday.
Both ads feature Arizona Sen. John McCain rebuking then-candidate Bush for refusing to disavow or condemn attacks on McCain's military record during the South Carolina Republican primary.
The Kerry campaign on Thursday agreed to pull ads featuring McCain at the Republican lawmaker's request. McCain has been lobbying in support of Bush but has criticized the swift boat ads.
In an interview with The New York Times that was published Friday, Bush said he didn't believe his opponent had lied about his service in Vietnam.
"I think Senator Kerry should be proud of his record," Bush said. "No, I don't think he lied."
Further stoking the fires of the controversy, Rear Adm. (Ret.) William Schachte Jr. told columnist Robert Novak for Friday's papers that he was "astonished" to hear Kerry's version of the events of Dec. 2, 1968, when Schachte was in command of Kerry aboard a skimmer boat on the Mekong River.
Schachte said that Kerry wasn't wounded by hostile fire, wasn't even under fire by the enemy and that he "nicked" himself with a grenade launcher and "requested a Purple Heart" afterward.
On the flip side, a swift boat crewman decorated in the 1969 Vietnam incident where Kerry won a Bronze Star says that not only did both men come under enemy fire, but also that his own boat commander, who has challenged the official account, was too distracted to notice the gunfire.
A 'Bitter Fight' to Move Beyond
Political observers on both sides of the aisle agree that the messy issue has distracted the campaign from more important issues � yet it still continues to make front-page news.
"We're now in a bitter fight. ... Kerry was undeniably a war hero ... and we ought to move beyond it," former Amb. Richard Holbrooke, a Kerry campaign adviser, told FOX News on Friday.
Holbrooke added that more focus should be placed, for example, on the U.S. troops dying in Iraq and the situation in Najaf.
"In the fog of war, people have different memories of what happened," he said. "These people are arguing about trivia."
GOP strategist Ed Rogers said the controversy was taking its toll on the Kerry campaign.
"He has made his service in Vietnam the � one of the pillars of his candidacy, and now he is in a dispute with people that have a different view and as he said, has earned the right to speak as veterans have, have earned the right to speak out," Rogers told FOX News on Friday. "I think there is going to be a more corrosive element for Kerry, and you're going to see the poll numbers change a lot."
A FOX News/Opinion Dynamics poll released Thursday shows that in a survey of a small number of veterans, Bush tops Kerry by 51 percent to 42 percent.
According to the University of Pennsylvania's National Annenberg Election Survey (search) released Thursday, veterans say they trust Bush more than Kerry as commander in chief, 56 percent to 38 percent. But many veterans surveyed dismissed the catfight surrounding Kerry's Vietnam service, saying it wasn't likely to change their votes.
In a Los Angeles Times survey, Bush led Kerry in the presidential race for the first time, drawing 49 percent among registered voters, compared with 46 percent for the Democrat.
Although a solid majority of Americans say they believe Kerry served honorably in Vietnam, the poll showed that the swift boat vets' attacks and Kerry's antiwar protests at home had left some marks: Kerry suffered small but consistent erosion compared with July on questions relating to his Vietnam experience, his honesty and his fitness to serve as commander-in-chief.
In that poll, 18 percent said they "believe that Kerry misrepresented his war record and does not deserve his war medals," while 58 percent said Kerry "fought honorably and does deserve" the medals.
Democratic consultant Steve Jarding said those numbers actually may mean Kerry is currying more favor among this voting demographic.
"About 25 percent of our military consider themselves Democrat. Kerry is getting 42 percent of those," Jarding told FOX News. "In your same [FOX News] poll, the majority of the individuals [who] had an opinion said that they thought the ads against Kerry were not good and they did not agree with them."
"So I look at this, if I'm John Kerry, and say they have made inroads," Jarding added. "These numbers suggest to me, at least where they stand today, that perhaps he's done that."
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Fri Aug 27, 2004 6:01 pm |
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Face the facts: Kerry DELIBERATELY LIED about being in Cambodia, and that's that.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Link, the Hero of Time
Vice Admiral
Joined: 15 Sep 2001
Posts: 5581
Location: Kokori Forest, Hyrule
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 4:24 pm |
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Do me a favor, Remember where you are 30+ years from now.
While your at it, ask Bush where he was during those months he was supposed to spend training in the National guard.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:15 pm |
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| Link, the Hero of Time wrote: | Do me a favor, Remember where you are 30+ years from now.
While your at it, ask Bush where he was during those months he was supposed to spend training in the National guard. |
He WAS IN THE NATIONAL GUARD.
And what's that "Remember where you are 30+ years from now" comment?
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:00 pm |
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Dude, you cant lie about being somewhere. Stop being stupid.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:01 pm |
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| Defiant wrote: | | Dude, you cant lie about being somewhere. Stop being stupid. |
I am NOT being stupid--and you can lie about it.
The fact is that Kerry was NOT in Cambodia, and it has been proven.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:02 pm |
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Proof. That always comes into play in these debates.
OK, show me the money. I want the proof.
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Delta Quad 2003
Section 31 Guardian
Joined: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 3164
Location: Earth
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:03 pm |
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Rm, I want to believe you, but can you post a link or something as proof? Don't get me wrong, I am a HUGE fan of bush, but i want to know where you saw that Kerry was not in Cambodia.
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:07 pm |
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w00tish. Yah, the military isnt stupid, to where you can just lie and sneak around and stuff. Im tired of hearing all this where people say Kerry didnt earn his purple hearts.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:14 pm |
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| Quote: | John H. Hinderaker and Scott W. Johnson: Unwrapping Kerry's story of Christmas in Cambodia
John H. Hinderaker and Scott W. Johnson
August 18, 2004 HINDERACKER0818
On March 27, 1986, John Kerry took the floor of the U.S. Senate and delivered a dramatic oration indicting the foreign policy of the Reagan administration. As is his habit, Kerry drew on his Vietnam experience in explaining his opposition to the policy.
"I remember Christmas of 1968, sitting on a gunboat in Cambodia. I remember what it was like to be shot at by Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge and Cambodians, and having the president of the United States telling the American people that I was not there."
To emphasize the importance of this incident to his subsequent political development, Kerry asserted: "I have that memory which is seared --seared -- in me, that says to me, before we send another generation into harm's way we have a responsibility in the U.S. Senate to go the last step, to make the best effort possible to avoid that kind of conflict."
The story of his 1968 Christmas in Cambodia is one that Kerry has told on many occasions over the years. He invoked the story in 1979 in the course of his review of the movie "Apocalypse Now" for the Boston Herald. Most recently, Kerry told the story -- with remarkable embellishments involving a CIA man who gave him his favorite hat -- last year on separate occasions to reporters Laura Blumenfeld of the Washington Post and Michael Kranish of the Boston Globe.
Certain elements of Kerry's Christmas in Cambodia story were incredible on their face. Kerry attributed responsibility for his illegal 1968 mission to Richard Nixon, despite the fact that Lyndon Johnson was president at the time. The Khmer Rouge who allegedly shot at Kerry during his "secret" mission did not take the field until 1972.
Moreover, there is no record that Swift boats -- the kind of boat under Kerry's command -- were ever used for secret missions in Cambodia. Their size and noise make them unlikely candidates for such missions. Indeed, the authorized biographer of Kerry's Vietnam service -- historian Douglas Brinkley -- omits from his book, "Tour of Duty," any mention of a covert cross-border mission to Cambodia during Kerry's service.
Over the past few weeks, the Christmas in Cambodia tale, a keystone of John Kerry's Vietnam autobiography, has been revealed to be fraudulent. On Christmas 1968, Kerry was docked at Sa Dec, 50 miles from Cambodia, in an area from which the Cambodian border was inaccessible.
Last week, after the falsity of Kerry's Christmas in Cambodia account became public, the Kerry campaign issued a statement "correcting" the story. According to the Kerry campaign, the mission referred to took place in January 1969, when Kerry "inadvertently or responsibly" crossed the border into Cambodia. However, three of Kerry's Swift boat crewmates have denied entering Cambodia at any time, and no one has corroborated Kerry's claim.
The suggestion that Kerry may have "inadvertently" strayed into Cambodia -- leaving aside whether that was even possible -- constitutes a complete retreat from the point of Kerry's original story: that he lost his faith in government because the president lied about having sent American troops into Cambodia. And, of course, it contradicts his story about ferrying a CIA man to Cambodia.
Given the attention lavished on President Bush's service in the Air National Guard earlier this year, we thought that newspapers such as the Washington Post and the New York Times would want to devote comparable attention to John Kerry's Christmas in Cambodia story. We also thought they would want to consider what the falsity of Kerry's story might have to tell us about the uses to which Kerry is putting his Vietnam service in the current presidential campaign.
To date, however, we have been wrong. Neither the influential mainstream newspapers nor the broadcast television networks have reported the meltdown of Kerry's Christmas in Cambodia story. Only readers of Internet blogs such as ours have kept current on the exposure of Kerry's tall tale. Or on the Kerry campaign's lame efforts to resurrect a version of the story that contradicts what Kerry has said for the past 25 years, but allows Kerry to continue using his Vietnam experiences, real and imagined, for his own political purposes.
Whatever the reason -- and we have our suspicions -- when it comes to scrutiny of Sen. Kerry's veracity, the mainstream media are saluting, but they are decidedly not reporting for duty. |
http://www.startribune.com/stories/562/4933509.html
| Quote: | Where was John Kerry, Christmas 1968?
There is more investigative journalism being done in the blogosphere this week than in the Washington Post, NY Times and USA Today combined. I'm piggy backing the work of others and compiling in a nice package of every version of John Kerry's "Christmas in Cambodia" story I can find. I don't need to prove he was not in Cambodia or that Nixon was not President in 1968, follow some of my links, those facts have been well established. I'm just putting the varying versions all in one place.
As he told to the Boston Herald 1979
"I remember spending Christmas Eve of 1968 five miles across the Cambodian border being shot at by our South Vietnamese allies who were drunk and celebrating Christmas. The absurdity of almost killed by our own allies in a country in which President Nixon claimed there were no American troops was very real. "
In a country where they did not belong but had time to party. hmmmm
Congressional Record 1986
"Mr. President, I remember Christmas of 1968 sitting on a gunboat in Cambodia. I remember what it was like to be shot at by Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge and Cambodians, and have the President of the United States telling the American people that I was not there; the troops were not in Cambodia. I have that memory which is seared--seared--in me, that says to me, before we send another generation into harm's way we have a responsibility in the U.S. Senate to go the last step, to make the best effort possible in order to avoid that kind of conflict."
Same country, no party, firefight.
As told in his Biography
Christmas eve, 1968, turned out to be memorable....the crew headed their Swift...only miles from the Cambodian border. Because they were only an hour from that country, Kerry began reading up on Cambodian history.
hmmm One hour in a bout that does 30 MPH should be abut 30 miles right?
Entry into his own diary
A briefing with the Navy and another refueling and then away again. You have lost half the day just relaxing at Sa Doc, [60 miles from Cambodia] taking in the scene and basking in the security of your thoughts and the memories that today come steadily and quickly. Again you pull away from a pier and you start out on patrol ...
Or he might have spent half the day relaxing, 60 miles away.
The Boston Globe ran a fawning story in June 2004 which read:
"The Christmas Eve truce of 1968 was three minutes old when mortar fire exploded around John Forbes Kerry and his five-man crew on a 50-foot aluminum boat near Cambodia. ''Where is the enemy?'' a crewmate shouted." ...
To top it off, Kerry said, he had gone several miles inside Cambodia, which theoretically was off limits, prompting Kerry to send a sarcastic message to his superiors that he was writing from the Navy's "most inland" unit.
Firefight in Cambodia again. -While on patrol.
Associated Press 1992
...By Christmas 1968, part of Kerry's patrol extended across the border of South Vietnam into Cambodia.
"We were told, `Just go up there and do your patrol. Everybody was over there (in Cambodia). Nobody thought twice about it," Kerry said. One of the missions, which Kerry, at the time, was ordered not to discuss, involved taking CIA operatives into Cambodia to search for enemy enclaves.
Now he's in Cambodia bringing in CIA looking for "enemy enclaves."
1992 States News Service
Kerry, who served in Vietnam on a gunboat in the Mekong Delta from 1968 to 1969, said he was involved in a "black mission" near Cambodia. "On Christmas Eve of 1968, I was on a gunboat in a firefight that wasn't supposed to be taking place," Kerry recalled. "I thought, if I'm killed here, what will my family be told?"
If it was "near" Cambodia why wasn't he supposed to be there?
Kerry's own website has him working for the CIA
"My good luck hat," Kerry said, happy to see it. "Given to me by a CIA guy as we went in for a special mission in Cambodia."
I'd tell you about it- but then I'd have to kill you.
May 2000 U.S. News and World Reports
"Sen. John Kerry made his first forays into Cambodia during the Vietnam War as a Navy lieutenant on clandestine missions to deliver weapons to anticommunist forces."
OH!-- So now he was delivering weapons with the CIA.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reading this you could get the impression he really was in Cambodia on a CIA mission that he could not talk about. Remember the fact he was never in Cambodia was well established, check the many links. The whole CIA thing is dubious.
This is a compilation of many sources, including some incredible work from; No Oil for Pacifists, Tom Maguire and Insta P Mine was merely presentation. (Anyone wishing to mail this link to the mainstream media, feel free, we don't mind doing their job for them.)
If I missed any, lemme know. |
That is an opinion piece from http://wizbangblog.com/archives/003299.php
The Links in the set were:
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/007405.php
http://instapundit.com/archives/017068.php
http://kerryhaters.blogspot.com/2004_05_16_kerryhaters_archive.html#108520030112379671
http://www.boston.com/globe/nation/packages/kerry/journal_day2.shtml
http://www.boston.com/globe/nation/packages/kerry/061603.shtml
http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2004/08/a_cite_for_swif.html
http://instapundit.com/archives/017097.php
http://www.johnkerry.com/pressroom/news/news_2003_0601.html
http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2004/08/a_cite_for_swif.html
And it HAS been proven. You can check those links too, and I'll compile some more info for you.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Defiant
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 04 Jul 2001
Posts: 15946
Location: Oregon City, OR
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:18 pm |
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Thats not fair RM. You know I dont read long stories. Bad you. 
But you had to have known that I still wouldnt believe it.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:19 pm |
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http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/007405.php
| Quote: | August 08, 2004
Called to Serve Again
Captain Ed has the complete text of the letter that Swift Boat Veterans for Truth spokesman John O'Neill has sent to television stations in response to the Kerry campaign's threat to sue them if they run the veterans' ad. O'Neill's letter is absolutely devastating. If the facts surrounding John Kerry's fabrication of claims about his Vietnam service, and his slander of his fellow servicemen after he returned home after a mere four months in Vietnam, were widely known, Kerry would not stand a chance in November.
One key Kerry fabrication is the "Christmas in Cambodia" story that he has told over and over again throughout his career. O'Neill's letter treats this issue briefly:
If there is a consistent[ly] repeated story by John Kerry about his Vietnam experience, it is his story about how he and his boat spent Christmas Eve and Christmas of 1968 illegally present in Cambodia and, listening to President Nixon's contrary assurances, developed "a deep mistrust of U.S. government pronouncements." See Exhibit 24, Kranish book, p. 84. The point of his story was that his government and his commanders were lying about Kerry's presence in Cambodia on Christmas Eve and Christmas Day. During a critical debate on the floor of the United States Senate on March 27, 1986, Senator John Kerry said:
Mr. President, I remember Christmas of 1968 sitting on a gunboat in Cambodia. I remember what it was like to be shot at by Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge and Cambodians, and have the President of the United States telling the American people that I was not there; the troops were not in Cambodia.
I have that memory which is seared -- seared -- in me . . . .
Exhibit 25, Congressional Record - Senate of March 27, 1986, page 3594.
By way of further example, Kerry wrote an article for the Boston Herald on October 14, 1979:
"I remember spending Christmas Eve of 1968 five miles across the Cambodian border being shot at by our South Vietnamese allies who were drunk and celebrating Christmas. The absurdity of almost killed by our own allies in a country in which President Nixon claimed there were no American troops was very real."
See Exhibit 26.
The Christmas in Cambodia story of John Kerry was repeated as recently as July 7, 2004 by Michael Kranish, a principal biographer of Kerry from The Boston Globe. On the Hannity & Colmes television show, Kranish indicated that Kerry's Christmas in Cambodia was a critical turning point in Kerry's life.
The story is a total preposterous fabrication by Kerry. Exhibit 8 is an affidavit by the Commander of the Swift boats in Vietnam, Admiral Roy Hoffmann, stating that Kerry's claim to be in Cambodia for Christmas Eve and Christmas of 1968 is a total lie. If necessary, similar affidavits are available from the entire chain of command. In reality, Kerry was at Sa Dec -- easily locatable on any map more than fifty miles from Cambodia. Kerry himself inadvertently admits that he was in Sa Dec for Christmas Eve and Christmas and not in Cambodia, as he had stated for so many years on the Senate Floor, in the newspapers, and elsewhere. Exhibit 27, Tour, pp. 213-219. Sa Dec is hardly "close" to the Cambodian border. In reality, far from being ordered secretly to Cambodia, Kerry spent a pleasant night at Sa Dec with "visions of sugar plums" dancing in his head. Exhibit 27, p. 219. At Sa Dec where the Swift boat patrol area ended, there were many miles of other boats (PBR's) leading to the Cambodian border. There were also gunboats on the border to prevent any crossing. If Kerry tried to get through, he would have been arrested. Obviously, Kerry has hardly been honest about his service in Vietnam.
The other aspect of this story that is completely phony, but is not noted by O'Neill, is that Richard Nixon was not the President in December 1968. Lyndon Johnson was. It is simply incredible to me that for many years, reporters have mindlessly repeated this obviously false story without, apparently, noticing that it couldn't possibly be true.
And, if you're thinking that Kerry may inadvertently have gotten the year wrong, forget about it: Kerry was only in Vietnam for four months, and he spent only one Christmas there. It was 1968.
Those who think this story doesn't have legs are wrong. Kerry has made his service in Vietnam the centerpiece of his campaign, for reasons I can't understand. In contrast, his nineteen years in the Senate are a well-kept secret. So he has obviously opened the door to scrutiny of his record. Yesterday, we spent most of the first hour of our radio show talking about the Swift Boat Vets' charges. The response was unbelievable. The phones were ringing off the hook; we've never gotten so many calls. One Vietnam veteran was in tears as he talked about an upcoming family reunion, and wondered whether his nephews and nieces would think he was a war criminal, because of Kerry's slanders. Two Democrats called and tried to argue with us. A mistake.
The facts that the Swift Vets are prepared to prove are nuclear, far worse than one would assume from reading general newspaper coverage of the controversy. It is not enough to say that the Vets' evidence shows Kerry to be a liar. That is an understatement. In my opinion, they show Kerry to be a sick, deeply delusional man whose tenuous connection to reality would make a Kerry presidency an unacceptable danger to our country.
One of the Swift Boat Vets has said that he and his colleagues--who represent nearly all of the surviving veterans who served with Kerry in Vietnam--feel that they have been called to serve their country a second time. The veterans' problem, of course, is that they don't have any money. While borderline-criminal multi-billionaires like George Soros and spoiled entertainers like Ben Affleck have the Democrats' coffers overflowing with tens of millions if not hundreds of millions of dollars, the veterans have been able to raise only a pitiful $150,000--most of it from a single home-builder in Houston, who has been slandered for his efforts.
The newspapers and television networks will do their best to kill this story; it will never see the light of day unless citizens pay to put the veterans' ads on the air. We will never be able to match the Democrats' money, but you can do your part to help the veterans get their message out here.
DEACON adds: Richard Nixon (or was it Lyndon Johnson) was a pretty smart fellow. It appears that he knew more about where John Kerry spent Christmas 1968 than John Kerry did. And Nixon/Johnson didn't even have the benefit of a "seared" memory. |
http://instapundit.com/archives/017068.php
| Quote: | August 08, 2004
TOM MAGUIRE has already posted John Kerry's speech claiming to have been in Cambodia on Christmas day, 1968. But because this is a question of importance, and because some people might doubt the veracity of quotations pasted in from NEXIS, I thought I'd go to the law library and check it myself in hardcopy. (The law library was closed and the copiers were off, but I have a key, and -- let this be another lesson to bloggers everywhere -- a digital camera).
Here's a link to a larger version showing the exact page citation and context.
The evidence that Kerry wasn't in Cambodia seems pretty strong (see Tom Maguire's post, along with this letter) which makes Kerry's claim all the more difficult to understand.
It's possible, of course, that there's an innocent explanation for this, even if I can't quite think of one. Maybe Kerry was on a double-secret mission to Cambodia, such that everyone involved continues to deny it today. Except, inexplicably, for Kerry. . . . Or maybe his memory failed him -- though there's that "seared--seared--in" language to contend with when considering that hypothesis. Or he could just have been bragging. Your call. Personally, I remain more interested in what Kerry would do regarding the current war, but since he invites us to judge him on his Vietnam record, evidence that he might not be telling the truth about that record is obviously relevant.
At any rate, posting this should remove any doubt about what Kerry said, if not about what he did.
UPDATE: More here, including another Kerry quote on the same subject.
ANOTHER UPDATE: Reader Wayne Seibert emails: "You forgot about Kerry's mission to kill Col. Kurtz."
YET ANOTHER UPDATE: Several readers wonder why, if Kerry is really lying about having been in Cambodia on Christmas Day, 1968, somebody hasn't made something of it before? Beats me.
On the other hand, if it were false, you'd expect somebody from the Democratic spin machine to be coming forth with evidence that Kerry was in Cambodia then. But what did I get in the daily "Media Matters" email? A complaint that Bill O'Reilly compared Media Matters to the Klan.
MORE: Brian Rogge emails: "A blogger with a key and a digital camera? There's a novel there somewhere. Someone tell Roger Simon!"
Yes, as I photographed the pages with my little camera in the darkened library, it did make me think of old spy thrillers. Though only a particularly masochistic spy would copy the Congressional Record.
STILL MORE: More reports of Kerry's absence from Cambodia.
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http://www.boston.com/globe/nation/packages/kerry/journal_day2.shtml
| Quote: | John Kerry's Vietnam War journal
Excerpt from a type-written journal kept by John F. Kerry during his tour of duty in the Vietnam War:
You wake up with a start thinking that something is wrong and you grab the bars over your rack and swing down onto the metallic deck in the main cabin. Suddenly you are really awake and realize sheepishly that the startled concern that consumes you is prompted only by the conglomeration of noises that fill POF 44 and the fitful sleep that has characterized the nights on patrol. This is the fourth time during the night that sleep has been startled into movement - and each time the boat was riding smoothly and quietly. Once you were so sure of danger that you ran up into the pilot house and grabbed the throttles only to laugh with you men at your over-concern and reaction but deep inside you know and understand the pressures that are being brought to play with the mind and the body. And once you laughed at the Captain who talked in his sleep and who demanded that he be notified of any and all changes.
Sleep is probably one of the biggest battles of all on patrol. There is the constant temptation just to let go and relax and sleep all night -- trusting to the enth degree the young men who man your boat and who make up your watch sections. Eventually you begin to succumb and leave you life and that of the boat in your mouth and with eye lids that cascade down over dirty cheekbones, the sleep is light and restless. The radio cracks "Priority" and you are awake; loud explosions that rock the boat from the distance and the not-too-distant make you jump with a start ; ; but in a day you will be back in port and have a bed in which to lose completely the last three days of your life -- and then you think (unable to read 2 words) if you will lose these days.
A shower is two days behind you and two days hence but some how dirt doesn't (unable to read) you at all. It's good to be alive and to see the small ducks following their mother to food somewhere in the mangroves that line the bank of the river. Ducks remind you of geese and geese bring back the cold of Massachusetts and the memories of warm fires and chestnuts and houses that have been turned into Christmas lights and the feeling of warm skin meeting cold leather as you climb into a frosted automobile that will skid and slide and precariously take you to the even more precarious Christmas shopping.
You are running on one engine to preserve gas because your station is at the mouth of the Co Chien River and there is no outpost to give you fuel and no LSP to (unable to read) with milk and warm food. Today though luck is with POF 44 and her small generator is still running; still capable of warming the hotplate and giving you fried eggs for breakfast. For some reason though you don't feel like fried eggs and so you open a O-ration can that has peanut butter in it -- (unable to read) 11 which is smooth -- and also a can of strawberry preserve and a sandwich satisfies an already deranged stomach.
Today you move to the northern end of the area -- towards Cambodia -- and excitement tingles the nerves that appreciates the new and the unexplored and you enjoy starting the other engine, hearing the deep throb of the diesel engine and the hums as the boat reaches for the step and shoots spray out on both sides as she moves up the river. The (unable to read) shows you where you are and where you are going and you trust the mesmeric sweep that illuminates islands and boats and jumps and sandbars. The (unable to read) hasn't been working very well and without it speed can be dangerous but you have moved over this part of the river before and nothing can stop you now. A (unable to read) sweeps by on one side and you feel large and protective(?) compared to this small fiberglass hull. The patrol officer warns you of a sandbar ahead in an area that you haven't traversed and you thank your wisdom for stopping and asking advise about the upper reaches of the river.
Everything you around you is quiet and the only humdrum breaking an otherwise still southeast Asian morning in the now high whirl of your engines. All across the river, in splotches of green, are pieces of mangrove that have eroded away from the banks which are now plying a drifting and uncertain route with the tidal current that sweeps through the Co Chien.. It makes you think of the story of the wooden seagull that followed the air currents of the world and that saw the movements of all the world's people below its graceful and motionless wingspan. You wish that you could be transformed into that itinerant nothingness that lets you watch the world pass by with all its gross trimmings but which demands nothing of you. To be free so that you can comment or not comment as you see fit and then just hop on a breeze and be blown restlessly to some new horizon with new hope and new strength. You think for a moment of Pogo and cartoon characters who have all the freedom of the world and whose audience, it seems, pays acute attention to his pronouncements while he is really quite free from their criticisms - that is at least his ears aren't scorched by the vulgarities of people who know nothing and so nothing and sense nothing. Lucky Pogo you think and then your boyish reverie come quickly to a close.
Ahead lies the APL from which you will refuel and steal a morning meal. Both operations completed you pass from the Navy and again enter the world of beauty that surrounds you as you move up the meandering channel of the main water route to Cambodia. Its daylight now and moving with you are junks and barges and swamps of all sizes and shapes and colors and within each person with a world of his own fears and hopes and aspirations. Simplicity characterizes everything around you and because of this an unassuming peace envelopes the fatigue with which you (were) traveling). A small canal looms up on the left and methodically, as though the chart by your side were slave to the wheel, you turn the boat into it and enter still a more perfect world of shapes and colors.
With the early morning sun the green of the rice paddies that are only a few scant years from you on either side assume a dark, rich sunglass tint that reeks of Polaroid lens but which brings to you all the yen and desire to lie down in it and romp. Trees grow out of the water and buffalo, dark black and strong, rub their backs against them and rid themselves of pesky itches. It is almost a crime that you should cause ripples to disturb this scene and you slow the boat to minimum revolutions -- an act that causes you to almost drift with ghost like qualities through the morning mist and the beauty that is all around you. Yes, it is good to be alive but suddenly you see helicopters move in formation, ugly and insect-like across the sky en route to some encounter with Charlie. They blot the sky and your mind and you think again of losing all that is in front of you. Too quickly though this country reaches out with its naturalness and beauty to bring thoughts back away from the dismal. In front of you now is a town -- a complete town lying on the water with all its life and hustle-bustle and hurly-burly rustling energetically in front of your eyes. (unable to read) in the market and houses on thin poles rising above the mud; Vietnamese flags blowing in the wind from trees and houses and poles and windows.; it looks almost like a tournament in the days of the round table and you expect knights on horses, sweaty and ready for combat to come prancing out into the center and receive the blood thirsty acclaim of the multitude that crowds the street along the canal and the boats and craft that play in it.
A briefing with the Navy and another refueling and then away again. You have lost half the day just relaxing at Sa Doc, taking in the scene and basking in the security of your thoughts and the memories that today come steadily and quickly.
Again you pull away from a pier and you start out on patrol -- through a rickety drawbridge that pulls only one side up at an angle and that forces you to daringly pas your radar only inches away from destruction and court martials and investigations and when you get through you say the hell with the world and bask in self congratulations and cockiness. Again out into the big river where you can move with Huck Finn and the myriads of rafts that have traveled rivers and where you can again sense the life of the peasants around you.
No snow, no sleighs, no fat jolly Santa Claus on a corner with frosted lips and frozen hands and an outstretched arm that begs for the little more that people have at this time of year. Indeed, there is no familiarity with the date. Endless green and rainbows streaking cloud swept skies; more green and palm bushes swaddling muddy banks with knee deep footprints, soldier and peasant. Thatched roofs reaching out with dryness and beckoning for Robinson Crusoe to give up his weapon and join the hardy man; silence broken by airplane thunder and dusty swirls smoking upwards -- the trails from a lonesome bus on a rustic one-place road. Sampans drifting by caressing river currents and swirling with the swirl of eddies; a woman holds her baby tight against bare breast and nipple firm, gives life; my voice asks where she is going and unabashed she bares her breast to replace the youngsters fumbling, tiny lips.
An evening sun breaks though long, grey veneer of cloud that bangs mysteriously on the horizons edge, a rebel to the boring waste of blue (unable to read) it; more clips of weed pass under our keel as we charge forward. You wait sometimes for an explosion it there is a mine in once but there is none.
Tiny faces, wide-eyed and wondering, sad and bewildered, knowing death but not knowing why, knowing like but living it half dead, stare out of huts and hovels as we the bold go by. An outstretched palm speaks of self-determination and of all the good that we have done.
Fish nets dangling from teepee poles on the lush river bank are empty now, swaying to the gentle evening breeze. Waiting for high tide they will not fill tonight because it is nearing the hour for countrymen to go inside. Damn the fish and food your property is mine.
With the sun goes more than light,. With it goes life and country for with the darkness come the curfew and the silent stealth and steal of night. Nothing moves or red streaks dart across the pitch blackness to end the intent that was. What was that intent? It's curfew and there's no one there to tell. Wisps of smoke from errant fires blow with the wind and it you could read signals it would tell you of the things to come and the things that were.
Droning engines, throbbing on and on, mesmerize and push you towards the next turn and the next. An eye flickers up and catches sight of the world around you, glimpsing through your now idylls haze of reverie and wonders where you are. Two (unable to read) stalk your side and make you stop and you hold a mid stream briefing for the nights patrol. Suddenly there is an explosion and a mortar lands on the bank near all these boats. You jump and grab binoculars and search the back for activity but there is none and you wonder who sent it and from where. You call on the radio and tell headquarters that someone has shot a mortar near your boat and are there any friendly troops in the area. They say no and so you resign yourself that it is one of Charlie's continual sniper harassments. You continue to talk when with a thumping crash another mortar round lands fifteen yards away in the water. The boats come alive. You scramble. Before all the lines are untied you are going full speed, the two (unable to read) beside you. Then, while you radio and say that you are receiving fire they turn sharply to the right and go up a river in back of where the fire come from. Two men run madly down the beach in your direction and yell for your boat to come over and you charge the engines whit all their force and not caring if there is sand or rock or no water at all the boat begins to charge the beach, jumping with excitement and with the power of a horse that has just been uncaged from the starting gate. You stop dead in your tracks and the men yell that the VC attacked their village and wounded one man and they have roved down in the direction of where we are. So Charlie had shot at us hoping we would answer with a hail of fire that eliminate our own troops. I looked quickly at my watch and noticed that it was three minutes after this truce has been initiated. So this was Charlie's truce.
We moved down towards the small stream where some sampan activity has been sighted and there you sweated while you waited for the (unable to read) to come from the side they had dispersed to. You will send them up the stream which is too small for you to enter and you will cover them from as close as possible. You look around and hear your own breathing, smell the hear in the air, see your men now in flak jackets and battle helmets and ready for might come. The (unable to read) arrive and then again, from the bushes, we start to take sniper fire, small arms weapons that can kill but which you feel is just a ploy by Charlie to bring the fire in. Suddenly, in a flash that is a moment of hell and blindness the read erupt and bullets walk out across the water at your boat and those around you. Then screaming flashes of tracer, red and deadly come at you with a terrifying suddenness that catches all by surprise and you watch for a moment as red streaks move at you in a three dimensional kaleidoscope out of the water. From (unable to read) and Swift a cacophony or explosions as they answer with anger shame and surprise the wall of fire that met theirs. Quickly, too quickly you are past the ambush point and you wheel your boats around to run back and out into the main river. From somewhere reason calls and you grab the loud speaker and yell to your men to hold your fire until right on top of the spot and then there is thunder again and no hearing and only red streaks tearing towards the land. You are in the river and away and you slow your boat. The (unable to read) are with you and you stop to catch you breath. Somehow, while firing you had grabbed the radio and told headquarters that you were receiving automatic weapons fire and were clearing the area to the north and you remember how you had to shout to make yourself heard. Now you hear them recalling the help gunships that were scrambled while you were in there and you realize how quickly help was on the way. You cannot help but feel a throaty exhilaration because you have gone through and there are no scratches and you are still free. Two friendly troops have been wounded, Vietnamese you are told and the (unable to read) are called to Medvac them. While you sit in the river and rearm the smaller boats beside you receive twenty rounds of sniper fire from the bank on the other side but it falls short of the boat and so you don't give a damn.
You head back towards Sa Dec to make your report while transiting the night darkness is broken by tracers flying up out of a Vietnamese outpost that is celebrating Christmas. The bullets pass dangerously near your boat and you think of the stupidity of the whole thing and the ridiculous waste of being shot at by your own allies and so angry you jump on the radio and ask who the hell is shooting at you and inform your seniors that they had better squared away before you return fire. Apologies are quick to (unable to read) but they mean nothing amidst all the chaos and waste.
It's cool now and the evening has closed around you to become full night. The night for once is comforting and you take a coke and some peanut butter and jelly and go up on the roof of the cabin whit your tape recorder and sit for a while, quietly, watching flares float silently through the sky and flashes announce disquieting intent somewhere in the distance. You call down to one of your men and ask him to draft a message to the Admiral in Command of all Naval Forces in Vietnam and also to the Commander of Market Time. IT says "Merry Christmas from the most inland Market Time unit." You hope that they'll court marshal you or something because that would make sense. But the night soothes everything and the people and things that are close to you dart through the mind and bring the only warmth and peace that there is. Visions of sugar plums really do dance through your head and you think of stockings and snow and roast chestnuts and fires with birch logs and all that is good and warm and real. It's Christmas Eve. |
http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2004/08/a_cite_for_swif.html
CHECK THAT LINK
http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2004/08/a_cite_for_swif.html
CHECK THAT LINK[/quote]
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Republican_Man
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:19 pm |
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| Defiant wrote: | Thats not fair RM. You know I dont read long stories. Bad you.
But you had to have known that I still wouldnt believe it. |
I've got more info above. At least skim through it, Defiant or at least someone who would like to know the truth.
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Delta Quad 2003
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:22 pm |
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Proof enough for me. Makes sense, and I can not argue with what I read.
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Republican_Man
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:28 pm |
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And here's the larger version of
:
This is a FOX News article discussing the debate.
| Quote: | Kerry's Cambodia Claims Scrutinized
WASHINGTON � Part of John Kerry's (search) strategy in his White House bid is to play up his military service in Vietnam, but a group of veterans is challenging the Democratic presidential nominee's story.
A new book called "Unfit for Command" (search) raises questions about Kerry's claims that he was in Cambodia on Christmas Eve 1968 at a time when the U.S. government was insisting that there was no American military presence in that country.
In an Oct. 14, 1979, letter to the editor of the Boston Herald, Kerry wrote: "I remember spending Christmas Eve of 1968 five miles across the Cambodian border being shot at by our South Vietnamese allies who were drunk and celebrating Christmas. The absurdity of almost being killed by our own allies in a country in which President Nixon claimed there were no American troops was very real."
Kerry, a senator from Massachusetts, also talked about his experience during a speech on the Senate floor on March 27, 1986.
"I remember Christmas of 1968 sitting on a gunboat in Cambodia. I remember what it was like to be shot at by Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge and Cambodians, and have the president of the United States telling the American people that I was not there; the troops were not in Cambodia," Kerry said.
Kerry was an officer in the Navy and served four months in Vietnam. His official biography says he earned a Silver Star, a Bronze Star with Combat V and three Purple Hearts, but critics have challenged whether he deserved some of his medals.
The Kerry campaign first asserted that the Massachusetts senator never said that he was in Cambodia, only that he was near the country. But when presented with a copy of the Congressional Record and asked about Kerry's letter in the Boston Herald, the campaign said it would come up with an explanation. After repeated phone calls, there was still no clarification.
Among the organizations challenging Kerry on his military background is Swift Boat Veterans for Truth (search), which describes itself as a group that included men who served with Kerry in combat as well as some of his commanders.
The group also produced a television ad blasting Kerry for his characterization of his Vietnam service.
But while the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth have been hammering Kerry's record, many of the sailors who served under Kerry's command is backing their former commander. Additionally, Vietnam hero Sen. John McCain (search), R-Ariz., has decried the tactics of this group and urged President Bush to distance himself from it; the Bush campaign has refused to do so thus far. |
www.foxnews.com
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Defiant
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:42 pm |
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Yah, but im too damn stubborn to admit if you were right anyways. But you so arent.
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Republican_Man
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:47 pm |
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| Defiant wrote: | | Yah, but im too damn stubborn to admit if you were right anyways. But you so arent. |
I AM right and you know it. It has been PROVEN that he lied about being in Cambodia. Of course you would say, "Why would he do such a stupid thing like that?" Well, ask Kerry, a liar.
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Delta Quad 2003
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:52 pm |
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Wow dude, those are some powerful words. I admit that I do not like Kerry at all, but I do think that is a little harsh.
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Caboose - I can't feel my face.
Church - Shut up caboose!
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Republican_Man
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:58 pm |
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| Delta Quad 2003 wrote: | | Wow dude, those are some powerful words. I admit that I do not like Kerry at all, but I do think that is a little harsh. |
| Quote: | | I AM right and you know it. It has been PROVEN that he lied about being in Cambodia. Of course you would say, "Why would he do such a stupid thing like that?" Well, ask Kerry, a liar. |
I'm sorry, I agree. When you read it "at face value" it seems harsh, and I probably shouldn't have said that, hence I am sorry, but I was just stating that he is a liar, which is true on more than just this issue.
But back on topic...He lied about Cambodia in particular. He wasn't there.
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Delta Quad 2003
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:01 pm |
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I will agree with you on that front, you are correct. I believe that he has lied about his being in Cambodia, due to the readings and clippings I have been presented with. I can only surmise that the reason for this is simple. He wanted to be a national hero, and telling that story got it.
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Caboose - I can't feel my face.
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Republican_Man
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:02 pm |
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| Delta Quad 2003 wrote: | | I will agree with you on that front, you are correct. I believe that he has lied about his being in Cambodia, due to the readings and clippings I have been presented with. I can only surmise that the reason for this is simple. He wanted to be a national hero, and telling that story got it. |
You know, that's a good thought for a reason, delta 
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Delta Quad 2003
Section 31 Guardian
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:05 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | Delta Quad 2003 wrote: | | I will agree with you on that front, you are correct. I believe that he has lied about his being in Cambodia, due to the readings and clippings I have been presented with. I can only surmise that the reason for this is simple. He wanted to be a national hero, and telling that story got it. |
You know, that's a good thought for a reason, delta |
About time someone realizes.  . I have to admit, yet again, that I do not like Kerry, and that DOES have some influence on my statements. However, The evidence provided is solid. The quotes he has made in the past, and the recent "changing" of his story do show that he has, in fact, lied to the people.
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Defiant
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:24 pm |
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If he lied, then the military would strip him of his medals. Do you see that happening?
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Republican_Man
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:27 pm |
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| Defiant wrote: | | If he lied, then the military would strip him of his medals. Do you see that happening? |
No, but if so they should.
And I say "no" because he'll find a way around it, but he DID lie. And that's a fact.
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Delta Quad 2003
Section 31 Guardian
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| Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:35 pm |
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According to the evidece presented, Kerry did lie. Now, if more information is presented, I will eveluate it, and possibly change my standing. I noted that you said that the military would strip him of his medals if he lied. This is not necessarily true. The military would investigate first, and that could take SEVERAL years. Since the evidence has been brought up recently that he may have lied, I am sure the military is investigating it now.
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Church - Shut up caboose!
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