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Angeldust
The Mob Queen
Joined: 28 Jul 2004
Posts: 6498
Location: In your most wonderful, screwed up dreams. :P
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 Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:47 pm |
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Now, see, the winky face is making me suspicious that you are in my camp as an infiltrator... 
Speaking of Thomas Jefferson, I just bought his biography... I'm sure that if there were any issues with his slaves, it will be in there...
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"You want to dance with the angels? Then embroider me with gold; and I will fly with the angels...and you can dance with me."
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DemonClassY
Commodore
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 1986
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, U.S.A
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:49 pm |
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And not all the slave owners abused their slaves. Came the Civil War, some slaves stayed and fought by the side of their masters. I don't think that an abused or raped slave would stay givenj the chance to run and fight against their master.
(BRB, guys.)
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First city to bring home the Lombardi Trophy and Lord Stanley in the same season!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GO PENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Angeldust
The Mob Queen
Joined: 28 Jul 2004
Posts: 6498
Location: In your most wonderful, screwed up dreams. :P
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:51 pm |
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You would be surprised the resignation and hoplessness you run into after decades of oppression...I'm not entirely sure they didn't stay right where they were cause they didn't think they had a choice...
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"You want to dance with the angels? Then embroider me with gold; and I will fly with the angels...and you can dance with me."
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DemonClassY
Commodore
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 1986
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, U.S.A
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:53 pm |
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The slaves weren't stupid. If they saw an oppurtunity, they were gone...if they wanted to go. They were just treated good with certain masters. I'm not talking specificly about Jefferson but I know that there were some masters with slaves by their side fighting.
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First city to bring home the Lombardi Trophy and Lord Stanley in the same season!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GO PENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Angeldust
The Mob Queen
Joined: 28 Jul 2004
Posts: 6498
Location: In your most wonderful, screwed up dreams. :P
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:56 pm |
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That doesn't surprise me in the least. So, shall we return to Gay Marriage? I think we may have argued this topic senseless... 
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"You want to dance with the angels? Then embroider me with gold; and I will fly with the angels...and you can dance with me."
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:56 pm |
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| DemonClassY wrote: | | Came the Civil War, some slaves stayed and fought by the side of their masters. I don't think that an abused or raped slave would stay givenj the chance to run and fight against their master. |
Ok i think that you need to study up on the Civil War, The slaves were FORCED to stay and fight because they were promised their freedom. If they didnt fight then they would have been beaten and possibly killed. And alot of time they had children to take care of and the owners threatened to harm them.
P.S. the women , who were unable to fight, were being abused nomatter what they did.
BTW this topic is about gay rights, if you want to discuss the civil war then i'll gladly talk about it in a different thread.
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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DemonClassY
Commodore
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 1986
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, U.S.A
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:58 pm |
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Kay then start a new thread...
Now who wants to start the debate back up?
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First city to bring home the Lombardi Trophy and Lord Stanley in the same season!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GO PENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:59 pm |
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personally im waiting for RM to reply to my previous posts. 
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:00 pm |
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| gilbert3729 wrote: | | BTW this topic is about gay rights, if you want to discuss the civil war then i'll gladly talk about it in a different thread. |
The Civil War isn't what we're discussing--it was to discuss a good and valid point that I made to back up my arguement.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:09 pm |
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I know, thats why i said that ill discuss it in another thread.
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:13 pm |
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| Quote: | | ...a good and valid point that I made to back up my arguement. |
It was discussing ONE OF MY ARGUEMENTS.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Jeff Miller
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 22 Nov 2001
Posts: 23947
Location: Mental Ward for the Mentaly Unstable 6th floor, Saint John's 1615 Delaware Longview Washington 98632
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:52 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | In this case, APOLOGY NOT EXCEPTED. It is horrible what you did, alright, Jeff, you shouldn't have done that--you can keep EXTREME anti-semetic (towards Christianity) beliefs OFF of this forum, it's JUST as bad as racism! |
I didn't ask for people to accept my apology I just said I'm sorry. What I said is my opinion I could care less what people think about me as for the EXTREME anti-semetic beliefs I don't belieive in anything its my opinion. Theres a big difference. Oh and being told what to post and what not I'll stop posting my opinions when people stop saying that Civil unions are ok and agree that same sex couples should have rights.
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| ~Tony Montana wrote: | | You know what you need people like me people for you to snub your nose at and point at saying there is a bad man. Well guess what This bad man is leaving. Say goodnight to the BAD MAN! |
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:54 pm |
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| Jeff Miller wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | In this case, APOLOGY NOT EXCEPTED. It is horrible what you did, alright, Jeff, you shouldn't have done that--you can keep EXTREME anti-semetic (towards Christianity) beliefs OFF of this forum, it's JUST as bad as racism! |
I didn't ask for people to accept my apology I just said I'm sorry. What I said is my opinion I could care less what people think about me as for the EXTREME anti-semetic beliefs I don't belieive in anything its my opinion. Theres a big difference. Oh and being told what to post and what not I'll stop posting my opinions when people stop saying that Civil unions are ok and agree that same sex couples should have rights. |
I did NOT say that you shouldn't express your opinions--It's just what you said was horrible and it is my belief that it's not appropriate to be spoken of.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Theresa
Lux Mihi Deus
Joined: 17 Jun 2001
Posts: 27256
Location: United States of America
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| Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:56 pm |
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| Quote: | Oh and being told what to post and what not I'll stop posting my opinions when people stop saying that Civil unions are ok and agree that same sex couples should have rights.
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That didn't make any sense...
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Some of us fall by the wayside
And some of us soar to the stars
And some of us sail through our troubles
And some have to live with our scars
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:23 am |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | I did NOT say that you shouldn't express your opinions--It's just what you said was horrible and it is my belief that it's not appropriate to be spoken of. |
It's my belief that the way you speek about gay rights is horrible and that it is not appropriate to be spoken of.
Can you see the similarities between our arguments?
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:26 am |
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| gilbert3729 wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | I did NOT say that you shouldn't express your opinions--It's just what you said was horrible and it is my belief that it's not appropriate to be spoken of. |
It's my belief that the way you speek about gay rights is horrible and that it is not appropriate to be spoken of.
Can you see the similarities between our arguments? |
No, I CANNOT. This is because I am NOT going around BASHING gays like Jeff was Christianity.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:34 am |
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Isnt saying that gay people do not deserve the same rights as everyone else a form of "bashing gays?"
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:42 am |
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| Quote: | | Isnt saying that gay people do not deserve the same rights as everyone else a form of "bashing gays?" |
No one here once said gays don't deserve rights. There is no comparison. A better comaprison would be "I hate fruits, so they shouldn't get married." RM was never once discriminatory in his posts. The other guy said "book full of lies". Which is making fun of our religion. That is bashing.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:49 am |
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| gilbert3729 wrote: | | Isnt saying that gay people do not deserve the same rights as everyone else a form of "bashing gays?" |
No, it's NOT a form of bashing. I have NOT ATTACKED them or said that I hate them or anything. I just believe in a specific definition of marriage and yet am NOT discriminitory in my remarks aobut it.
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No one here once said gays don't deserve rights. There is no comparison. A better comaprison would be "I hate fruits, so they shouldn't get married." RM was never once discriminatory in his posts. The other guy said "book full of lies". Which is making fun of our religion. That is bashing. |
It's NOT "making fun" of our religion--it's ATTACKING our religion. Otherwise I completely agree with you.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:54 am |
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| Founder wrote: | | No one here once said gays don't deserve rights. |
Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:34 am Republican_Man wrote:
Yes, they ARE still human beings, but they should not have the right to marry.
This statement says that gays dont deserve rights.
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:57 am |
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| gilbert3729 wrote: | | Founder wrote: | | No one here once said gays don't deserve rights. |
Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:34 am Republican_Man wrote:
Yes, they ARE still human beings, but they should not have the right to marry.
This statement says that gays dont deserve rights. |
No it does NOT, damn it! I have NOT said that they don't deserve rights EXCEPT for marriage--that's NOT ALL RIGHTS! Stop putting words into my mouth that just aren't there.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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gilbert3729
Commander
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Posts: 390
Location: New England, USA
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:01 am |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | No, it's NOT a form of bashing. I have NOT ATTACKED them or said that I hate them or anything. |
Saying that someone dosent deserve rights is a form of bashing that person. It's not a direct form of hate or bashing, like hitting someone, but it is bashing none the less. What you said implyies that they are not equal with you. If that is not gay bashing then I dont know what is.
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Soylent Green is people!!!
John Kerry...
Bringing complete sentences back to the White House.
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Jeff Miller
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 22 Nov 2001
Posts: 23947
Location: Mental Ward for the Mentaly Unstable 6th floor, Saint John's 1615 Delaware Longview Washington 98632
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:01 am |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | No, I CANNOT. This is because I am NOT going around BASHING gays like Jeff was Christianity. |
Uh just currious I didn't anywhere say Christianity I said the Book. I never said that I was bashing any group of people. I'm not very religous as everyone knows but doesn't multiple groups of people use the bible? so how could I be Bashing one group of people? wouldn't I be bashing them all if my goal was to attack christianity by using the bible as a reason? I'm not wanting to start a fight or anything I just wanted to point out that I wasn't attacking anyone.
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| ~Tony Montana wrote: | | You know what you need people like me people for you to snub your nose at and point at saying there is a bad man. Well guess what This bad man is leaving. Say goodnight to the BAD MAN! |
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Founder
Dominion Leader
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 12755
Location: Gamma Quadrant
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:03 am |
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The "book" is the Bible right? Yes....several religions follow it. By calling their basis for their faith lies. We will take it bad...
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:12 am |
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| gilbert3729 wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | No, it's NOT a form of bashing. I have NOT ATTACKED them or said that I hate them or anything. |
Saying that someone dosent deserve rights is a form of bashing that person. It's not a direct form of hate or bashing, like hitting someone, but it is bashing none the less. What you said implyies that they are not equal with you. If that is not gay bashing then I dont know what is. |
Not true! I have NOT given hate speech towards gay people, alright! Come on, you're putting words into my mouth that just aren't there! I do NOT HATE GAYS, damn it! I have NOT given hate speech toward them!
| Jeff Miller wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | No, I CANNOT. This is because I am NOT going around BASHING gays like Jeff was Christianity. |
Uh just currious I didn't anywhere say Christianity I said the Book. I never said that I was bashing any group of people. I'm not very religous as everyone knows but doesn't multiple groups of people use the bible? so how could I be Bashing one group of people? wouldn't I be bashing them all if my goal was to attack christianity by using the bible as a reason? I'm not wanting to start a fight or anything I just wanted to point out that I wasn't attacking anyone. |
The Book was the Bible! And you are DEFINITLY not religious! You're a secularist and an athiest! And you WERE attacking myself and my religion.
| Founder wrote: | | The "book" is the Bible right? Yes....several religions follow it. By calling their basis for their faith lies. We will take it bad... |
Agreed.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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