Will we ever see a supersonic helicopter?

Superman · Fleet Admiral Joined: 06 Dec 2003 Posts: 10220

I know this isn't really a Trek topic so if the moderators delete it, that's fine. But I wanted to get some people's views.

BTW, I'm not a scientific person. I couldn't hold my own in ANY type of scientific debate. But I can generally understand what other people say on various scientific subjects.

Basically, do you think we'll ever see a supersonic helicopter? Is it possible (in the future) or will it always be an impossibility?

I know a helicopter, as they are today, couldn't achieve Mach 1+ because, for starters, the rotor blades would tear off (and they couldn't even achieve such a speed anyway). And you couldn't create stronger rotor blades because the chopper would not fly as well.

Is there anyone here with any thoughts? I'd be interested to hear them.

(Imagine if there was a supersonic helicopter though, what a sight it would be)

IntrepidIsMe · **Thu Apr 22, 2004 8:03 pm**

Why bother to build one, though? Or is this just for kicks?

Not that there is any problem with that,

EnsignParis · Lieutenant Commander Joined: 07 Sep 2001 Posts: 257

I'm guessing not, for a traditional helicopter at least.

For a few different reasons...

1 - Like you said, centrifugal forces would probably rip off the rotor blades.
2 - The aerodynamics of a helicopter are weird (don't quote me, I'm just making an observation), and going at extremely high speeds would probably rip them to shreds.

We would probably need to add jet thrusters, stronger rotor blades (maybe out of an extremely light, but extremely strong material...like titanium or using nanotube technology) and a sleek, odd looking, aerodynamic design, but then we are basically looking at a Harrier jet with rotor blades on the top...doesn't make much sense to me.

So the answer to your question is: probably not.

PrankishSmart · **Fri Apr 23, 2004 7:38 am**

Well I can't see it happening anytime soon. something like 90% of a helicopters power is just to keep it in the air, so you would need a very powerful and light engine.

Right now we have just started to achieve super cruise (supersonic flight without afterburner), so to have a helicopter go supersonic, would also be super cruise (unless you can stick an afterburner on the back!).

Superman · Fleet Admiral Joined: 06 Dec 2003 Posts: 10220

Thanks for your interesting views, folks.

I can't see any government ever wanting to go to the expense of even trying to develop a supersonic helicopter. We have the Harrier Jump Jet, we have many different types of planes that can achieve supersonic speed and excel in a combat situation. Why would we need to build a supersonic helicopter?

But it would be an interesting sight to see. A helicopter igniting it's twin turbines and exceeding Mach 1+

But I think we'd be more likely to see a flying submarine before we saw a supersonic helicopter.

PrankishSmart · **Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:43 am**

webtaz99 · **Sun Apr 25, 2004 2:52 pm**

The problem with helicopters is:

As a blade rotates, it sees more lift in the "forward" direction, but also more drag. It then sees less drag and less lift in the "backwards" direction. This imbalance is compensated for by changing the pitch of each blade as it rotates.

But even with "unbreakable" blades, there is a point where the blades will stall if they are picthed any farther, and the helicopter will try to "pancake" or flip over. In fact, if a pilot doesn't adjust the blade pitch and throttle while taking off, the same thing will happen.

Superman · Fleet Admiral Joined: 06 Dec 2003 Posts: 10220

I'm just wondering if a supersonic helicopter falls into the POSSIBLE IN THE FUTURE category or TOTALLY IMPOSSIBLE category.

Some people said we'd never have a machine heavier than air that could fly. Some people said we'd never break the sound barrier. Some people said the Harrier Jump Jet would be impossible.

If a supersonic helicopter were to be created, it would need the most intelligent whizzkid behind it. But could even the most intelligent whizzkid develop such a concept. Some things are possible in the future but some things are totally impossible such as exceeding the speed of light-that's one thing NO-ONE or NOTHING will ever do.

Like I said earlier, it's not really practical to even try and develop a supersonic helicopter. It wouldn't be able to do anything that's not already done by current jets. But if it is ever possible, it's a long way down the line.

If it ever does become reality, the nation that achieves it will alter the balance of world power.

PrankishSmart · **Fri Apr 30, 2004 1:24 am**

I still don't think the helicopter would be possible. The power requirements would be too high and the blades would not be able to handle the wind.

Right now, we have a new JSF from lockheed martin. It can (almost) vertical takeoff, go over mach 1.5 and vertical land again.

Superman · Fleet Admiral Joined: 06 Dec 2003 Posts: 10220

Cost would be a prohibitive factor even if a particular government wanted to develop a supersonic helicopter. I think we'd be talking billions, maybe even tens of billions.

But who knows what the future really holds?

webtaz99 · **Sat May 08, 2004 2:46 pm Can you guys read?**

If you won't belive me, go to

http://www.copters.com/aero/retreating.html.

Superman · Fleet Admiral Joined: 06 Dec 2003 Posts: 10220

Webtaz, I believe you, friend.

I'm just talking away on a subject I am interested in. And like I said at the beginning of this topic, I'm not a scientific person and people know more about me.

But I believe you and I value the opinions of everyone who has replied in this topic.

I just wish it were possible. I'd love to fly upwards in a supersonic helicopter.

webtaz99 · **Mon May 10, 2004 5:01 pm**

If you just want to go up real fast, how about a rocket or a military fighter jet?

If you've never seen it, check out the Delta Clipper (DC-X) program. It was the first rocket to land vertically.

Superman · Fleet Admiral Joined: 06 Dec 2003 Posts: 10220

I'll look into it, Webtaz. Thanks.

Accompanying a pilot in a military jet and exceeding the speed of sound is on my 'to do' list in life. It costs a lot of money but I'd love to go through the experience.

webtaz99 · **Thu May 13, 2004 2:30 pm Documentaries**

I have often seen non-military people allowed to ride a modern fighter jet (F-14, F-15, F-18, etc.) becuase they are making a documentary film, a TV show or local news. You might be able to use that to your advantage.

Hyper · Ensign Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 60 Location: UK

The problem you have with a supersonic helicopter are the blades. A normal aerofoil profile doesnt work very well at supersonic speeds. You tend to get lots of turbulence and drag, and very little lift. You could change the profile accordingly, but then you dont get lift at slow speeds. So in theory you could have adaptive cross sectional rotors, but then you'd have the issue of weight. Best idea would be those 'whisper craft' off the film 'the 6th day', sort (and I use sort very loosely!)of similar in how the Lockheed JSF works in VTOL mode.