| Do you think that Israel is getting out of hand/Does this trouble you? |
| Yes |
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66% |
[ 6 ] |
| No |
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33% |
[ 3 ] |
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| Total Votes : 9 |
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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 Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:30 pm New Hamas Terror Chief killed in Iraq |
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| FOX NEWS wrote: | Hamas Leader Killed in Israeli Missile Strike
Saturday, April 17, 2004
GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip � Israel assassinated Hamas leader Abdel Aziz Rantisi (search) in a missile strike on his car Saturday, part of its declared campaign to wipe out the Islamic militant group's leadership ahead of a planned Israeli withdrawal from the Gaza Strip.
Two of Rantisi's bodyguards were also killed.
Thousands of angry Palestinians marched through the streets of Gaza City, carrying pieces of the charred car and shouting, "revenge, revenge." One man stuck his hands into the car, pulled them out covered with blood and waved them in the air.
"This blood will not be wasted," said Ismail Haniyeh, a Hamas (search) leader. "We are not going to give up."
The attack came less than a month after Israel killed Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin (search) in an air strike outside a Gaza City mosque. Israel has said it would strike at Hamas leaders whenever possible, and Rantisi � named Hamas chief in Gaza after Yassin's killing � was near the top of the list.
Israeli security forces went on high alert, fearing reprisal bombings.
Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat (search) condemned the killing as a "brutal assassination," while Israel's vice premier, Ehud Olmert, warned there would be more such attacks.
Earlier Saturday, a Palestinian homicide bomber blew himself up at an industrial park between Israel and Gaza, killing an Israeli border policeman. Israeli officials said there were no connection between the bombing and the killing of Rantisi.
Rantisi's car was hit by two missiles Saturday evening, about a block from his house in the Sheik Radwan neighborhood of Gaza City. After the explosions, Israeli helicopters were heard in the area.
"I heard the sound of the explosion. It was a small one followed after less than two seconds by another one," said Rawhi Ghazal, 35, who owns a nearby shop.
Rantisi ran about 15 yards from the car, collapsed and lost consciousness, Ghazal said. The Hamas leader, his body pocked with bloody wounds and blood streaming from his head and neck, was rushed to the hospital and into emergency surgery, but he died five minutes after arriving.
Two of Rantisi's guards, Akram Nassar, 35, and Ahmad Jhura, 32, were also killed, hospital officials said. Five pedestrians were wounded.
Israeli officials accused Rantisi of planning a large attack on Israel to solidify his leadership of Hamas and to retaliate for Yassin's killing. Hamas is responsible for most of the 112 homicide bombings that have killed 465 people on the Israeli side during 3 1/2 years of violence.
"There is no question. This is a great success," Israeli Cabinet minister Uzi Landau (search) said.
Israeli government sources said they had struck at the first available opportunity, but had to wait for weeks because Rantisi had surrounded himself with children.
Palestinian Prime Minister Ahmed Qureia (search) accused the United States of encouraging Israel's actions. Israeli sources said the strike was not coordinated with Washington.
British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw condemned Israel's policy of targeted killings as "unlawful, unjustified and counterproductive." In Cairo, Hossam Zaki, spokesman for the Arab League, called the assassination "a criminal act" that puts an end to all peace efforts.
Rantisi was one of the most hard-line members of the militant movement, which rejects all compromise with Israel and calls for the destruction of the Jewish state.
Israel had tried to kill Rantisi on June 10 when three Apache helicopters fired at least seven missiles toward his car in a crowded Gaza thoroughfare, reducing his vehicle to a scorched heap of metal. Rantisi escaped with a wound to the right leg. Two Palestinian bystanders were killed.
In a retaliatory attack the next day, 16 Israelis were killed in a Hamas suicide bombing in Jerusalem.
Israel has stepped up strikes on Hamas in advance of a proposed unilateral pullout from Gaza. Israeli officials have said they hope a string of military successes will show that the militant group was not driving it out of the coastal strip.
"No terrorist can go home to sleep at night thinking he is immune," Olmert, the Israeli vice premier, said Saturday. "They (militants) are in our crosshairs ... and should run and hide from the Israeli forces who can get to them everywhere."
After Rantisi was killed, thousands of people protested in cities across the West Bank and Gaza, calling for revenge. Palestinian prisoners in one lockup in southern Israel briefly rioted, media reported.
Mosques announced his killing over loudspeakers, and protesters in Gaza burned tires in the streets.
During the mourning period for Yassin, Rantisi was defiant about Israel's threats against him. "We will all die one day. Nothing will change. If by Apache or by cardiac arrest, I prefer Apache," he said.
Hours before Rantisi was killed, a Palestinian homicide bomber blew himself up at the Erez industrial zone, killing an Israeli border policeman and injuring three security workers. The bomber had passed through a metal detector at a security check, said Col. Yoav Mordechai, a commander at the crossing.
The militant groups Hamas and the Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigade (search) took responsibility for the attack, identifying the bomber as Fadi Al-Amoudi, 22, from Beit Lahiya, a town near the crossing.
In further violence Saturday, a 5-year-old Palestinian girl was seriously injured in the West Bank town of Tulkarem when Israeli soldiers fired rubber bullets at the car she was traveling in, the army said. Troops shot when the driver did not follow orders to stop, the army said.
Palestinian hospital officials said the girl was hit with fragments of live bullets. The girl was being transferred to an Israeli hospital for treatment, the doctors said. |
Give your thoughts and ideas.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:33 pm |
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I do not think the US should back Israel, we need to repremand Israel because they are nearly as bad as the Palestinians.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:33 pm |
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My opinion is that even though it's good that another terrorist mastermind is gone, and Hamas' organization will have a problem, this troubles me.
Isreal wants peace--or so I believe they do, and so they say--but they are now doing stuff that may ruin the possibility for peace.
What do you all think?
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Monkey
Captain
Joined: 05 Feb 2004
Posts: 833
Location: On a quest you probably wouldn't believe.
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:50 pm |
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I think I'm going to live in a cave with cotton in my ears and die
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:57 pm |
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| JanewayIsHott wrote: | | I do not think the US should back Israel, we need to repremand Israel because they are nearly as bad as the Palestinians. |
We SHOULD back Isreal, I just don't really like their constant attacks on Palistinian LEADERS. It could ruin a chance for peace in the Middle East. And they are NOT nearly as bad as the Palestinians. They don't go in killing themselves to kill TONS of innocent civilians...they make strikes to kill LEADERS, or so is what I've seen.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 9:00 pm |
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no, we really should not formally back them....this is why alot of the Muslim world in the Middle east hates the US.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 9:03 pm |
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| JanewayIsHott wrote: | | no, we really should not formally back them....this is why alot of the Muslim world in the Middle east hates the US. |
Well, perhaps this attack should be COMPLETELY condemned by the US government, but we should NOT back our support behind our greatest ally in the Middle East.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 9:22 pm |
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Isreal has the NATURAL RIGHT to defend itself, but if they have any hope for peace, then they should cease these assaults.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sat Apr 17, 2004 10:51 pm |
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Palestine was there before Israel was...so in a way, they could be veiwed as that they are defending their land.
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IntrepidIsMe
Pimp Handed
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 13057
Location: New York
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 12:01 am |
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I really so no problem with this, as he was a Hamas leader, and they are a terrorist organization, aren't they?
-------signature-------
"Nelly, I am Heathcliff! He's always, always in my mind: not as a pleasure, any more than I am always a pleasure to myself, but as my own being."
-Wuthering Heights
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borgslayer
Rear Admiral
Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Posts: 2646
Location: Las Vegas
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 2:42 am |
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Abdel Ramtizi is a terrorist leader.
He order attacks on innocent civilians.
Why should he be allowed to live?
Everytime a peace plan is put out a terrorist attacks with a bomb and kills a some Israelli civilians and halts peace completly.
So really theres no point to terrorism thats why they attack terrorist leaders.
The reason why he is dead in the first place.
-- Even if the Israellis back out palestinian territory all together terrorist attacks will not stop --
( The only Palestinian Peace plan is for Israellis to surrender to palestinian hands live under a brutal islamic dictatorship )
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Pah-Wraith
Sheikh
Joined: 30 Nov 2001
Posts: 6012
Location: Londonistan.
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:17 am |
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| IntrepidIsMe wrote: | | I really so no problem with this, as he was a Hamas leader, and they are a terrorist organization, aren't they? |
Hamas are a Palestinian Liberation Organisation, they establish Schools and Hospitals etc, but Recently a Militant Wing was added to the Organisation (which many disagreed with) so basically the Militant Wing is a Terrorist Unit trying to pass themselves of under the Banner of Hamas.
| Republican Man wrote: | | Isreal has the NATURAL RIGHT to defend itself, but if they have any hope for peace, then they should cease these assaults. |
Israel is based on land that was originally Palestine. Palestinians resort to Militant Tactics because they are such a Small "Country" that it can't even start up a Military Force that is taken seriously. Hope for Peace?!? Are you Crazy?!? The Present Israel was founded on Violence and persecution and the colonisation of Palestinian Land. 
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:51 am |
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| Quote: | | Israel is based on land that was originally Palestine. Palestinians resort to Militant Tactics because they are such a Small "Country" that it can't even start up a Military Force that is taken seriously. Hope for Peace?!? Are you Crazy?!? The Present Israel was founded on Violence and persecution and the colonisation of Palestinian Land. |
I kind of agree with you. However, the Palestinians are also very violent and Yasser Arafat or whatever is the worst person over there. He does not want peace, he claims he does, but he does not. The Palestianins in my opinion are worse....not by much, but worse than the Israelis because they use terrorism and suicide attacks.
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Pah-Wraith
Sheikh
Joined: 30 Nov 2001
Posts: 6012
Location: Londonistan.
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:14 am |
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Hmm I'm biased due to my Religion and therefore will not comment on whom I find worse. I agree about Arafat, he is not a man whom I'd say is someone I support.
Here's a Photo of him and one of his best friends, someone whom I despise the Leader of an Afro-Centric Cult- Louis Farrakhan.
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IntrepidIsMe
Pimp Handed
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 13057
Location: New York
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 12:40 pm |
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| Pah-Wraith wrote: | | IntrepidIsMe wrote: | | I really so no problem with this, as he was a Hamas leader, and they are a terrorist organization, aren't they? |
Hamas are a Palestinian Liberation Organisation, they establish Schools and Hospitals etc, but Recently a Militant Wing was added to the Organisation (which many disagreed with) so basically the Militant Wing is a Terrorist Unit trying to pass themselves of under the Banner of Hamas.
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Oh, I see. Hmmmm, well, as long as they only kill the terrorist unit leaders, then I don't see why not.
-------signature-------
"Nelly, I am Heathcliff! He's always, always in my mind: not as a pleasure, any more than I am always a pleasure to myself, but as my own being."
-Wuthering Heights
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 12:45 pm |
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| borgslayer wrote: | Abdel Ramtizi is a terrorist leader.
He order attacks on innocent civilians.
Why should he be allowed to live?
Everytime a peace plan is put out a terrorist attacks with a bomb and kills a some Israelli civilians and halts peace completly.
So really theres no point to terrorism thats why they attack terrorist leaders.
The reason why he is dead in the first place.
-- Even if the Israellis back out palestinian territory all together terrorist attacks will not stop --
( The only Palestinian Peace plan is for Israellis to surrender to palestinian hands live under a brutal islamic dictatorship ) |
You know, this is an interesting point...
| JanewayisHott wrote: | | ...the Palestinians are also very violent and Yasser Arafat or whatever is the worst person over there. He does not want peace, he claims he does, but he does not. The Palestianins in my opinion are worse....not by much, but worse than the Israelis because they use terrorism and suicide attacks. |
Yes, that is true. They DON'T want peace, even though they say they do, so maybe this is a good thing...I'll have to ponder it some more.
Now, do you all see some similarities to this situation, like I do, to the Cardassian-Federation-Bajor-Maquis stuff in Star Trek?
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:10 pm |
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There are also similarites in Enterprise....with the Xindi wanting to destroy the human race, but its based on false facts that come from the sphere builders.....like we are the humans, followers of terroists are Xindi....and the sphere builders are the corrupt middle eastern leaders and terrorists.
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Pah-Wraith
Sheikh
Joined: 30 Nov 2001
Posts: 6012
Location: Londonistan.
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 2:15 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | | Yes, that is true. They DON'T want peace, even though they say they do, so maybe this is a good thing...I'll have to ponder it some more. |
No Republican Man, you can't type cast a Race by the Actions of a few Terrorists. I know quite a few people from Palestinian Families living in Egypt and they have dedicated they're lives to Promoting Peace Plans.
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 2:26 pm |
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What I meant (not speaking for RM) is that Arafat does not want peace, I am not saying that is a constant for the Palestinian people though.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 5:39 pm |
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| Pah-Wraith wrote: | | Republican_Man wrote: | | Yes, that is true. They DON'T want peace, even though they say they do, so maybe this is a good thing...I'll have to ponder it some more. |
No Republican Man, you can't type cast a Race by the Actions of a few Terrorists. I know quite a few people from Palestinian Families living in Egypt and they have dedicated they're lives to Promoting Peace Plans. |
I appologize...You make a good point, Pah. It's similar to the Iraq situation--a few terrorists/insurgants and some leaders, but not TOO many...Like Janeway said, it is groups like Hamas and then Arafat that don't want peace.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:09 pm |
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Well, actually, I have a point to make:
Why do SO MANY Palistinians act against Israel for the wrong?
And what similarities do you think this has to the Cardassian-Federation-Bajoran-Maquis conflict?
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:32 pm |
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| Republican_Man wrote: | Well, actually, I have a point to make:
Why do SO MANY Palistinians act against Israel for the wrong?
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Please clarify.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 9:20 pm |
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Well, I don't really know...I've just seen large groups of palestinians killing Israelis, and after 911 I saw MANY of them dancing in the streets, happy! It was sickening...
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Puck
The Texan
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 5596
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 9:21 pm |
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Agreed......your question just didnt make since to me
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Apr 18, 2004 9:27 pm |
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I can see how it was confusing.
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"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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