| Is It Alive? |
| Yes |
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22% |
[ 4 ] |
| No |
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77% |
[ 14 ] |
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| Total Votes : 18 |
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| Author |
Message |
Captain Patrick
Commodore
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2421
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 Thu Feb 16, 2006 10:09 pm The Internet: LifeForm or Not |
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Me and a few buddies were hangning out and chating at a Internet Cafe about an hour ago and i am not sure how this got bought up but, What do think of the Internet being classifed as a Life Form?
Reasons i think it is a Lifeform:
No one owns the internet. No one runs it, It was never planed to be what it is today, It just happened, It is now the Mutant outgrowth of a 1969 US Defensive Advacned Research Projects Agencys(ARPA) Experiment. It was orginal called ARPANET, but was then taken over by the National Scientific Foundation(NSF) in 1983. But since then it has evolved to be not just one machine but Millions of Computers spanning the entire World. In my opinion the Net became a living being in Symbotic Relationship with humans in April 1995 when NSF Cut the last "Apron String". Humans have not seen anything like it before the net is a massive computer with a life of its own, now it is a symbotic creature in the sense we give it power and life and it gives us its services.
The Internet shows most of the characteristics of life:
| Quote: | | Theme 1: Cells= All living things are composed of one or more cells. Different types of cells have different "jobs" within the organism. Each life form begins from one cell, which then will split |
The net started as one machine and has split to millions of machines, each with its own job.
| Quote: | Theme 2: Organization
Complex organization patterns are found in all living organisms. |
The net shows a Extreme high organizational structure.
| Quote: | Theme 3: Energy Use
All organisms use energy. |
The net uses energy in the form of electricy.
| Quote: | Theme 4: Growth
All organisms grow and change. |
The net has grown alot in the last two decades.
| Quote: | Theme 5: Reproduction
All organisms reproduce in order to continue the species' life. |
HMMM..
Well what do you think on this matter?
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Joey
Rear Admiral
Joined: 13 Jul 2001
Posts: 4708
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| Thu Feb 16, 2006 10:16 pm |
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well it depends if you look at it like that, then yes, but then couldent other things be alive?
what about cars?
TVs?
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LightningBoy
Commodore
Joined: 09 Mar 2003
Posts: 1446
Location: Minnesota, U.S.A.
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| Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:44 pm |
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Fire:
It grows, It consumes, It reproduces, It moves, It dies. No cells, but techincally, neither does the internet. If you want to call computers cells, then i'm going to call plasm molecules cells too.
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Curtis
Fleet Admiral
Joined: 29 Sep 2001
Posts: 14903
Location: Wisconsin
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| Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:52 pm |
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| harrykim234 wrote: | well it depends if you look at it like that, then yes, but then couldent other things be alive?
what about cars?
TVs?
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So-so true, if this was the case...practically (almost) everything around us would be alive in one way or another.
Cars? That explains why I think they're staring at me with those creepy headlights...they are! 
TVs? My television is alive!!!! I'm so sorry I said all those bad things to you tv...so-so sorry!!! 
(Crazy guy, I know  )
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Leo Wyatt
Sweetest Angel
Joined: 25 Feb 2004
Posts: 19045
Location: Investigating A Crime Scene. What did Quark do this time?
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| Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:57 pm |
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Are you guys okay? Do I need to call a shrink? I am just joking okay... I didn't mean no harm... I sometimes think the tv is talking to me but it is not. It is my imagination. lol I hope noone took offense cause I was honestly joking.
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Seven of Nine
Sammie's Mammy
Joined: 16 Jun 2001
Posts: 7871
Location: North East England
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 2:31 am |
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Fire I always call life-imitation (I'm sure there's a proper definition of it somewhere, but I don't know it).
The internet acts as if it's alive, but it isn't really.
(and for reprodution, what about LANs and WANs and MANs? )
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lionhead
Rear Admiral
Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 4020
Location: The Delta Quadrant (or not...)
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 7:03 am |
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without humans internet won't sustain itself. no reproduction without humans.
-------signature-------
Never explain comedy or satire or the ironic comment. Those who get it, get it. Those who don't, never will. -Michael Moore
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Joey
Rear Admiral
Joined: 13 Jul 2001
Posts: 4708
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 7:25 am |
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| Seven of Nine wrote: | Fire I always call life-imitation (I'm sure there's a proper definition of it somewhere, but I don't know it).
The internet acts as if it's alive, but it isn't really.
(and for reprodution, what about LANs and WANs and MANs? ) |
((MANS?))
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jonathan95
Delta Prime
Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1544
Location: UK Newcastle
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 7:37 am |
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| Quote: | LANs, WANs, and Other Area Networks
It�s about more than distance
Computer networks come in many different shapes and sizes. Over the years, the networking industry has coined terms like "LAN" and "WAN" attempting to define sensible categories for the major types of network designs. The precise meaning of this terminology remains lost on the average person, however.
Area Networks
For historical reasons, the industry refers to nearly every type of network as an "area network." The most commonly-discussed categories of computer networks include the following -
Local Area Network (LAN)
Wide Area Network (WAN)
Metropolitan Area Network (MAN)
Storage Area Network (SAN)
System Area Network (SAN)
Server Area Network (SAN)
Small Area Network (SAN)
Personal Area Network (PAN)
Desk Area Network (DAN)
Controller Area Network (CAN)
Cluster Area Network (CAN)
http://compnetworking.about.com/od/networkdesign/l/aa040801a.htm <- more can be found here |
Hope that helpted.
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Captain Patrick
Commodore
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2421
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 11:51 am |
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Most all of you makes good points but it could be considered to be alive on a base level, But then again maybe not. Was just an interesting dicussion to bring up
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TrekkieMage
Office Junkie
Joined: 17 Oct 2004
Posts: 5335
Location: Hiding
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 2:16 pm |
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| lionhead wrote: | | without humans internet won't sustain itself. no reproduction without humans. |
I was going to say something to that effect.
Computer's depend on human interaction. They do only what humans tell them to do. They have no instincts, they have no natural capabilities. And they can't reproduce, that requires humans to assemble them and tell them how to work.
But it is an interesting idea...
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Joey
Rear Admiral
Joined: 13 Jul 2001
Posts: 4708
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 2:37 pm |
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what about A.I.
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EnsignParis
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 257
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 4:11 pm |
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| lionhead wrote: | | without humans internet won't sustain itself. no reproduction without humans. |
Realize though, that without food, and without "input" from our environment, we wouldn't be able to reproduce. No reproduction without our needs, either.
| TrekkieMage wrote: | I was going to say something to that effect.
Computer's depend on human interaction. They do only what humans tell them to do. They have no instincts, they have no natural capabilities. And they can't reproduce, that requires humans to assemble them and tell them how to work.
But it is an interesting idea... |
However, you're right on that point. Computers only do what they are told to do. They have no (or at least very little) subjective abilities. They cannot interpret things and they cannot identify objects, unless they are given a highly specific description of what they are looking for.
| harrykim234 wrote: | | what about A.I. |
As for artificial intelligence, my understand of how it works, is that we still have a LONG way to go before A.I. has any potential for independant thought. AI gives the illusion of a learning computer, that's partially why I'd say it's called artificial. For example, let's say you're playing a computer game, the computer will only respond to you actions with what it was programmed to respond with. In Mortal Kombat 2, I remember, you can uppercut the opponent until about the 3rd fight on "very easy" difficulty, then after that, if you attempt to do it, they will often counter it with a quicker uppercut. Another example, if you're playing Black and White 2, your "creature" apparently "learns" as the game goes on, but the only way it "learns" is for you to basically set the creature's own settings to how you want it to behave. It's not actually learning, it's just recieving values for certain variables in it's programming.
For these reasons, I voted no, it's not a living thing, but your proposal is quite philosophical and kind of blurs the line between living and non-living. Kind of like the doctor in Voyager.
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lionhead
Rear Admiral
Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 4020
Location: The Delta Quadrant (or not...)
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 5:25 pm |
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Oh alright then: Life means having a concience(sp?), a will to survive. Internet lacks that.
-------signature-------
Never explain comedy or satire or the ironic comment. Those who get it, get it. Those who don't, never will. -Michael Moore
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EnsignParis
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 257
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 5:51 pm |
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What about amoebas? Do they have a conscience?
See? It's not as black and white as most people think it is. It's easy to say what is living and what is not, but when it comes down to defining a clear line, it gets difficult.
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Captain Patrick
Commodore
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2421
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 6:18 pm |
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| EnsignParis wrote: | What about amoebas? Do they have a conscience?
See? It's not as black and white as most people think it is. It's easy to say what is living and what is not, but when it comes down to defining a clear line, it gets difficult. |
True it is very hard to determine what the true meaning of aliving being is, so i guess it is just comes down to what the person seeing it thinks the definition of life is, but to me i still am stuck with it might be alive.
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Fri Feb 17, 2006 6:28 pm |
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It's technology. It doesn't even reproduce asexually, much less sexually.
Man makes it. Sure, it's made of cells and has some of the qualities of a life form. Heck, it even has homologous structures to humans (CPU/brain). But does that make it a life-form--of which you really mean to say an organism? No, of course not. It's technology and it doesn't reproduce or anything like that on its own.
So I say, no. Not at all.
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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lionhead
Rear Admiral
Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 4020
Location: The Delta Quadrant (or not...)
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| Sat Feb 18, 2006 2:56 am |
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| EnsignParis wrote: | What about amoebas? Do they have a conscience?
See? It's not as black and white as most people think it is. It's easy to say what is living and what is not, but when it comes down to defining a clear line, it gets difficult. |
and amoeba has a conscience, it has a will to survive. It does things instinctivly.
Thats what living is about.
-------signature-------
Never explain comedy or satire or the ironic comment. Those who get it, get it. Those who don't, never will. -Michael Moore
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:11 pm |
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What about plants? Some react, some don't. However, plants have the inherent ability to reproduce. Computers do not. Humans reproduce computers. Same goes for the Internet. It can't reproduce itself; however, humans reproduce it through the creation of more web pages.
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Captain Patrick
Commodore
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2421
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| Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:14 pm |
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What if the Internet hasn't reproduced yet BECAUSE it hasn't needed to because it isn't nearing its death yet? Perhaps the internet IS a lifeform, it just hasn't needed to prove itself to us. Perhaps it never will.
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lionhead
Rear Admiral
Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 4020
Location: The Delta Quadrant (or not...)
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| Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:31 am |
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| Captain Patrick wrote: | | What if the Internet hasn't reproduced yet BECAUSE it hasn't needed to because it isn't nearing its death yet? Perhaps the internet IS a lifeform, it just hasn't needed to prove itself to us. Perhaps it never will. |
Of course it never will. Its not intelligent.
-------signature-------
Never explain comedy or satire or the ironic comment. Those who get it, get it. Those who don't, never will. -Michael Moore
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Captain Patrick
Commodore
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2421
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| Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:36 am |
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| lionhead wrote: | | Captain Patrick wrote: | | What if the Internet hasn't reproduced yet BECAUSE it hasn't needed to because it isn't nearing its death yet? Perhaps the internet IS a lifeform, it just hasn't needed to prove itself to us. Perhaps it never will. |
Of course it never will. Its not intelligent. |
Can you prove that for a fact?
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Republican_Man
STV's Premier Conservative
Joined: 26 Mar 2004
Posts: 14823
Location: Classified
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| Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:49 am |
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Yes. In essence it is not intelligent. It is an electronic network. The burden is on you to prove it is intelligent.
The internet has no mind of its own. It only does what it's programmed to do.
-------signature-------
"Rights are only as good as the willingness of some to exercise responsibility for those rights- Fmr. Colorado Senate Pres. John Andrews
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Joey
Rear Admiral
Joined: 13 Jul 2001
Posts: 4708
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| Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:50 am |
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but couldent it be programed to be inteligent?
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Captain Patrick
Commodore
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2421
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| Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:01 am |
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I don't mean interlligant on a Sentient Level but a small Ameoba like level.
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